The daily digest of Twin Cities culture | Secrets of the City

I think you should have featured comments like they do on the Star Tribune.

No more mb at work. :(

I have to quick go register as "Just Sayin'" so I can use that sometimes.

Sweet, been waiting for this for a long time.

Word.

If you can access MNSpeak at work, you can log-in.

@kal

I didn't need to go to Loring Park to be appalled by the price of the tickets. I did that without getting up from my couch.

Thanks, trolls! This is why we can't have nice things!

I wonder if Bud will register. Thanks for ruining it for us, you troll.

Jane, I just checked the other Jane, and it was a spammer. So I've deleted that account. You may register as the real Jane.

While I am OK with the registration thing, the 8 character restriction should be expanded

I believe I remember simpleton saying that the 8 character limit was the main reason he hadn't registered.

meh.

I call aliecatisthecoolestchickinminneapolissoyoushoulddateher if that happens!

I was hoping for just like, 12 characters. That would be enough to satisfy me.

In your face, spammer jane!

Thanks, Max.

I'm confused. A few people have mentioned registration preventing them from accessing MNSpeak at work? Home come?

I'll work on the 8 character thing. I've tried to change that before and it caused a bunch of errors. I think its coded into the database field.

jason did you miss all the excitement mid week in the DOJ blacklist post?

That (and the post about finding Keith Kennedy) was probably the straw that broke the camel's back.

I, for one, am glad that MNspeak's required registration will end racism, stupidity, and troll-dickery everywhere forever and ever. Did you hear me? FOREVER!

I don't care for this at all.

My experience is that corporate security policies differ. Some cannot access site like LinkedIn, MySpace. Others can get to the site but not access their account.

This happens frequently on Ning sites too. Can see the main page but not access account or download presentations.

Corporate America screwing the worker again :)

I can access MNspeak at work, no problem, but we have such a strict internet usage policy, I try to stay below the radar and not log into anything. I guess if they want to catch me on MNspeak, they will do so whether I'm logged in or not. I actually really like my company and the strictness makes total sense, so I'm not even complaining. Fortunately they are probably too busy to check on the likes of me.

Still, I will miss the fake fake Larry Craig. That 8-letter limitation has got to go.

My work story is the same as Jane's.

Huh.

Sorry. But there is a bit of a herd mentality on this site, IMHO.
Also a tendency to stop legitimate discussion/dialog through the use of illogic, such as the ad hominem attack ("troll," "hater," "stick up the ass," "nasty").
I'm just looking for clarification of the trolling policy, as it seems to be warranted with the recent hubbub.

I'm not defending binky.
However, the shark circle that surrounded binky last week was certainly no endorsement for the members involved. You only embolden someone like that when you engage and corner him.

Meanwhile, the ad hominem attacks--and ostracism of unpopular opinions-- happens all the time here in the course of ordinary discussion...

Do I get a coupon for a free smoothie?

I'm just looking for a clarification of what constitutes trolling.
Knowing this will reduce the potential for such downward spiraling personal battles as happened last week with binky.

While we wait for Matt and/or Max to clarify between trolling and merely expressing an unpopular opinion, I hope arthappy clarifies between herding and merely expressing a popular opinion.

but I doubt someone like binky really understands the response to what he was up to.

I'm sure he does, he just doesn't care.

So it takes two years to be considered a troll?

A troll is a troll. Five minutes, two years, doesn't matter. I was just pointing out that there was a long history of his trollish behavior prior to you arriving here.

I think it can. Unless the person is willing to take the time to set up a dummy email account on Yahoo, Excite, etc. (Are you listening Fake Larry Craig?), Max and Matt have a more efficient way to track a person. And it certainly makes it easier for them to ban a commenter. Such a person is going to have to repeatedly set up dummy email accounts in order to keep registering so they can comment.

Good question, Kurtis. Hm. Off the top of my head, I'm thinking the tendency to shut down an unpopular or alternative opinion by various non-discoursive/illogical means (applying a derisive/ad hominem label to it, for instance; and mutually supporting this sort of action among the group) is herd mentality.
Responding to the unpopular opinioner express his/her opinion with one's own popular opinion while not attempting to shut out the unpopular idea is "merely expressing a popular opinion."

Again, I ask you to provide specific examples (short of the Binky blowout last week) of this so-called "ad hominem" argument by the "herd."

Sir, this horse, it seems to have been beaten to death.

Specific examples. Okay, then I've really got to run and get some stuff done.
I've seen the term "hater" tossed around often as a way to halt discussion. Also, to a degree (legitimately or no), the term "troll."
But specifically (I mention this at the risk of portraying myself as a shrinking violet, but the personal names I've been called are the ones that most readily spring to mind), I was told I had a "stick up my ass" for simply expressing a contrary opinion here about "memes." I've also been called a "dick," "a nasty drunk" (which may have a basis in truth, come to think of it), and several other names, even though I'm generally careful to keep to discussing the ideas.

At least I'm discussing behavior and ideas, Kurtis. Not attacking character, which has a tendency to shut down discussion. I'm also willing to be proven wrong. In fact, I'm waiting for the group to prove me wrong...

I didn't call anyone a "witless cow." "Herd mentality" refers to a legitimate social phenomenon.

Arthappy, I'll put it even more bluntly than Kurtis. Regarding the examples involving you personally, you tend to come off as a bit of an condescending snob on here. For example, one of my first exposures to you (and forgive me if I don't recall the exact thread), you basically admonished the participants in the thread for the ribald, jokey nature of the conversation and for not discussing things of a more highbrow nature. Like, oh say, art. There is nothing wrong with wanting to talk about art, but that type of behavior is akin to walking into a wild, frat drunken party (I contend that the analogy is apt for many a MNspeak thread), and wagging your finger at the partygoers with a haughty "for shame." How do you expect people to react to you?

Kurtis, actually, pointing out the flaws or weaknesses of one's actions or behaviors--which basically comprises the job-description of the critic--is completely discursive and not at all thought-terminating. Case in point, we've just now had a fairly (some would say too) long and somewhat amiable discussion in which you ably contend with the merits of my arguments. This wouldn't have happened if I had indeed called everyone "witless," as you suggested...

A very elegant action on your part, which, I'm afraid, is all too much the norm here.

Smug, snob, hater, stick-in-the-ass, dick, condescending: I'm actually none of these things. Though I agree I may be, on occasion, a drunk...

Which makes it all that more important to go back to the original question/topic: what exactly does the label "troll" mean? It could be all too easy for people/the majority to use this label to end any argument they disagree with or find discomfiting. This is in the nature of thought-termination.

No one's answered the question.

Furthermore, you could always just look it up. Troll according to Wiki.

I'll point out here, at the risk of being obvious, that you just called me a "snob." This teaches nothing and cuts off all further discussion. A very elegant action on your part

You wanted to know how to avoid being insulted. We told you how, and it's unbelievably simple -- stop insulting us. Participate in the conversation instead of passive aggressively telling everyone they are witless cows. And no, you have never actually called anyone witless cows, but your attitude pretty much does it for you.

You may not believe you are condescending, but you are, and clearly I am not the only one who believes that to be true.

Thanks for the clarification, Max. So warnings by you are a requisite for being officially deemed a "troll." (I don't mean to continue begging the question; I have to admit I ignored most of his postings, and so have little understanding here...)

I'm of the opinion that a diversity of opinion is a good thing. Course, that's very self-serving since I often seem to find myself with ideas that conflict with the seeming majority.

Alie, your link was broken.

Yes, there will be plenty of warnings. Mostly, trolling is deliberately engaging in abusive or disruptive behavior. And there isn't that much, but one really determined troll can really mess up a good conversation, and can drive people who sincerely want to be part of MnSpeak away.

Sometimes the word is thrown around a little too freely. If I don't think someone is trolling, I will let people know.

Huh. Wikipedia actually has some things to say about trolling that somewhat validate my points today. (Thanks Internet, and thanks Aliecat; the emphases below are mine. I still suggest Matt and Max that this may warrant further discussion and policy-setting...)

The term troll is highly subjective. Some readers may characterize a post as trolling, while others may regard the same post as a legitimate contribution to the discussion, even if controversial. The term is often used to discredit an opposing position, or its proponent, by argument fallacy ad hominem.

Often, calling someone a troll makes assumptions about a writer's motives. Regardless of the circumstances, controversial posts may attract a particularly strong response from those unfamiliar with the robust dialogue found in some online, rather than physical, communities. Experienced participants in online forums know that the most effective way to discourage a troll is usually to ignore him or her, because responding tends to encourage trolls to continue disruptive posts  hence the often-seen warning: "Please do not feed the trolls".

Frequently, someone who has been labelled a troll by a group may seek to redeem their reputation by discrediting their opponents, for example by claiming that other members of the group are closed-minded, conspirators, or trolls themselves.

Recently, many websites have openly welcomed and encouraged trolling amongst their members.

wheeeee!!!!! we has registration, and it feels good.
I think I might be considered a light troll, although I have not been accused of such, however I do tend to screw with a thread now and then by throwing out Teucers mom, well...not literally, but I'm sure someone might, you know, thow her out.
I did have to drop the 2 when I registered, but that's ok. I like it. I feel kinda growed up now.

oh look, I have little red arrows pointing at me.
cool.

ok I'll bring it back to the point of the thread

I miss my 2.

I may regret posting this but I cannot find a hammer to hit my hand with at the moment...

Regarding trolls it is a subjective thing. But like a duck most people can see one when it shows up. Banning one person every blue moon tells me (my opinion) there is not enough banning going on. A free site that does not require signing in to post is going to attract some trolls. Thats part of the deal, good and bad.

I am a lurker but very rarely post here for a few reasons.

One, it was the trolls.

Two, is from Alies quote:

Why, because some of us have similar views, senses of humor, or don't agree with every single point made? I don't think this is herd mentality, just commonality.

I completely agree but because I differ on the similar views and commonality many/most on this site share I sit back and watch.

Let me stress, there is nothing wrong with commonality. But it also needs to be understood that when one person differs and then gets multiple responses challenging the view one gets the opinion of why bother.

Three, you all are a rather close group as far as online sites go. You know all the inside jokes and most have met each other (some of you have said for better and worse). So for the new kids (not to be confused with the 90s group who should never have thought about coming back) it is hard to figure out where to jump in and if the hard landing is worth it.

Okay, I'm not sure that even makes sense, but I was trying to say that people are more willing to take an opposing viewpoint seriously if you're not being a douchebag troll.

Long overdue.

Bravo!

"Sorry. But there is a bit of a herd mentality on this site, IMHO."

I don't think I've ever seen that on this site. Quite the opposite. There could be a white out blizzard blanketing the metro and if someone makes this observation, another will undoubtedly question it.

That said, some people will agree with each other. But that isn't a bad thing though, right?

Troll: Someone with an opposing point of view who consistently wins the arguments thereby irritating the robotic regulars.

Maz
Mayor
Troll Rapids, MN

"Which animal do you most closely identify with?
a. eagle
b. turtle
c. wolf
d. buffalo
e. bear"

After the large omelette for breakfast, cheese curds, gyro and large pop at Loring park today, I'm identifying with the buffalo right now.

To answer Maz's question, I'm a billy goat gruff.

And hopefully, not too many beards.

Based on his whining earlier in this thread, I would say Maz is something hung from a cross.

Yes, the problem is that Maz is being crucified for having an unpopular opinion. The opinion that popping into threads and calling liberals socialists is good conversation.

Aww, he looks so cute up there.

Oh man, I would have thought you would have worked in a poop joke with one of the choices being "turtle," wtfmn.

Based on his whining earlier in this thread, I would say Maz is something hung from a cross.

Arthappy, take note. There are no such comments from me on this thread.

Arthappy, take note. There are no such comments from me on this thread.

I wondered about that. I'd like to point out that I raised these questions not because I myself have ever been accused of trolling. I wasn't whining (about being called names or any other thing). I raised the issue because I believe in open discussion, and the proposed solution seemed like a rubber stamp that no one was questioning.

Maz, I know I'm a turtle, but would rather be more of a wolf. They seem like they are pretty bad-ass and independent, and aren't screwed if they end up on their backs. What does it mean? Also, it's kind of depressing that even the Lakota have personality tests.

I'm 1/10th but doesn't do me any good-- my oldest relatives pretty much refused to talk about it while they were alive, so I don't have any tribal affiliation or depressing stories about the "rez" or schools or whatnot.

But there are people who have accurately been identified as trolls. Just because the term has been misused does not mean it is never an accurate description. As in everything else, there is no one well defined line that one must cross to become a troll. And since there is a gray area, people will see things differently.

True, I agree with you. I was just raising the question in relation to a policy change. The response to my question(s) bore out a lot of my concerns, actually...

ok I'll keep signed in.

AH: This isn't a new issue, contrary to what you may believe. The question of registration and "what defines a troll" have been discussed a number of times on MNspeak.
You assume rubber stamp, but in reality, you're just late to the game.

There is no change in policy. Trolling has always been discouraged on this site, and people who were spammers or intentionally disruptive have been banned in the past, although only after much warning.

Arthappy, generally it is a good idea to actually get to know a community a little before making a series of snap judgments about it, which you have done repeatedly in this thread. You've only been participating actively on MnSpeak for a few weeks, and you've already decided its participants move in sheeplike lockstep and are quick to declare anyone they disagree with to be trolls. This simply is not the case. The few people who regularly get identified as trolls -- and there are very few -- do so because over a number of years they have regularly engaged in abusive behavior toward other MnSpeakers.

Most of the day-to-day, fly by abuse has come from unregistered users, or, sometimes, from registered users who log out and then use pseudonyms to write things they would never want their actual name associated with. This remedies that problem. Full stop. This is not some campaign to get rid of people whose viewpoints don't fit the norm. And, again, I think you would know that if you actually got to know the site, instead of making a series of public presumptions about it.

The registration stinks.

It limits our creativity by removing an avenue or additional channel of snark...ie "spellzgood" or "fake larry craig"....what is the internetz without snark?

It locks people out, the good and the bad.

Yet another freakin profile- OpenID FTW!

It probably will make this site more cliquey than it already is.

....all said I don't think its the right direction but it's not my site so I'll accept it.

Fair enough, Max...

I'm just happy to see a feature upgraded on MNSpeak!

I actually will miss the frequent updates on Kevin's delicate constitution. Oh, that guy! You never know if he's going to be frisky or spewin'!

You're right, andy, this is a real blow to Web 3.0, which I invented, whereby users incorporate Twitter-esqe updates into their usernames. It was going to be huge. Maybe Max can conjur up a system whereby you can expound on your user name at will, sort of like the little updates in Myspace.

Mood icons! Mood icons! Come on everyone, chant and bang your coffee cups on your desks. Mood icons! Mood icons!

I was going to complain about something having to do with the registration process, but then it ended up being a non-issue, so...that's...why...I'm..typing it here. Good story, e.

ericam: I hate the idea of registration, but Matt & Max came up with what I think is the best solution/compromise.

I would have prolly been more vocal, but after last weeks epic meltdown, it seems like the lesser of all evils.

ericam - I could never make fun of you! We have the same name!

Though I do often make fun of myself, so sorry for any confusion.

Choose your battles. Also, there's a distinction between "herd" and "community."

I thought fighting for a free and open discussion forum was a pretty good battle to pick...

Say what you will, I still believe there's a widespead tendency on this site toward groupthink (see that, I zigged away from the herd mentality thing just when you thought I would zag; suck it bovine, whoever you may be!)

That's a strange accusation to keep leveling against us, arthappy, without ever backing it up with examples.

So, if you want "free and open discussion" are you okay with the hurtful, racist crap that was on this site last week? I'm not. I'm sure Max and Matt aren't either, and it is their site. Go to the Strib if you want that, please.

moo!

Seems like arthappy is just a little bit argumentative, manifested by acting deliberately obtuse about this "troll" issue. Unless he really IS obtuse, which I doubt. I know a couple people who do this, ask questions in the guise of an open discussion but with something mildly aggressive about it. I just don't respond and they get off that kick.

I'd be a little annoyed, but remembered we have some other argumentative types around here who are regulars and have been here a while and what the hell, arthappy can fit in here somewhere. He's also pretty funny and generally cheerful.

Granted, I'm biased b/c he invented a drink named after my blueberry ginger pie.

Is it possible that it seems like everyone agrees because, at least personally, if someone says something I don't agree with I don't feel the need to put my two cents in every single time. I just sit back in my chair and think to myself, "Tish Tosh there goes another moron with an internet connection" If there is a discussion that I agree with I'm much more likely to contribute than if there is a hatefest going on.

I do like not having to type mnspeak everytime.

Well, it's the internet, not cradle school, ya know.

If a number of people deem it judgemental, don't you think maybe there is something there?

You're complaining about being treated uncharitable, yet just last week a number of us were encouraging you to join a meet-up. You consistantly mock other for their opinions on art with no real basis for your attacks other than what appears to be snobbery.

You strike me as a person who likes to complain and will not be happy doing otherwise.

*consistently

I'm all worked up now and my typing can't keep up with my thoughts. Excuse the poor grammar and spelling.

You smell bad, Baker.

Kidding. Actually, I would ask that we try to keep conversations as vivil as possible. There is a tendency to call people assholes, or whatever, and I think it's not especially condusive to good conversation. Although I have said this before, and always try to gently moderate when people seem to be just insulting each other.

Your perspectives seems to be that you're some lone crusader for fair and high-minded discussion and people are just being cruel to you in some real-life reenactment of the Allegory of the Cave, with arthapless as the persecuted lone bearer of greater truths than the mob has reckoned.

My perspective is that you talk a lot more about how everyone else is failing you than actually mounting the serious and high-minded discussion you aspire to. Abandon the former and take up the latter as your M.O. and you might find people more hospitable.

You were being a belligerent drunk when I called you that. Which I followed up with a :)

Most cases people realize to take a comment like that with a grain of salt. It's a public message board. Set up your own if you want to install strict rules and definitions.

If a number of people deem it judgemental, don't you think maybe there is something there?

You're complaining about being treated uncharitable, yet just last week a number of us were encouraging you to join a meet-up. You consistantly mock other for their opinions on art with no real basis for your attacks other than what appears to be snobbery.

You strike me as a person who likes to complain and will not be happy doing otherwise.

On the first point above, I just admitted I made a crucial error in using the word "herd." My other points, I think, were valid.

Meanwhile, the other points you make are not true.

Nothing is vivil enough for Max.

Meanwhile, the other points you make are not true.

And neither were most of yours. Even steven I guess.

I, for one, am constantly being abused here for my unpopular opinion that the film Cradle School III: Here Comes the Tickle Monster is the superior entry in the series.

I, for one, am constantly being abused here for my unpopular opinion that the film Cradle School III: Here Comes the Tickle Monster is the superior entry in the series.

Andy, you're such a philistine! Everyone knows the second film in that series is far superior. I mean, come on: Heather Locklear!

It's pretty infectuous.

It is not child porn. Max, come on, you're a tasteful guy. Surely you're not suggesting Sir Ralph Richardson's performance in Cradle School II: Mission to Moscow was anything less than the performance of a lifetime. So what if he was wearng diapers and being burped by Heather Locklear?

It's pretty infectuous.

That's the fucking pisser about the whole fucking deal.
Man, I love all you guys, really!

I feel like someone is going to call for a group hug, so I'm just gonna head to the bar.

I, for one, am a purist. I found the original Cradle School: Dollars to Diapers beyond compare.

That's why Heather Locklear was replaced by Naomi Watts in the Cradle School prequel, À La Recherche du Cradle School: In the Court of the Crimson King.

I'm beginning to think you all really have no taste in cinema.

Good God, people, the whole cradle school series was blatantly ripped off from French Director Pierre Chingnon's masterful Berceau école trilogy!

Seriously, I keep telling you to watch the originals! The American versions are just idiotic by comparison!

I don't have time to be a cinema buff. I am too busy becoming a music knowledge MASTER.

Has anybody here played the video game? Is it worth the forty bucks?

Grand Theft Hot Wheel, it's called.

Er, Grand Theft Big Wheel, I mean.

Max, I will go to the mat with you on this one. You're just flat-out wrong. Your Francophilia is blocking your aesthetic receptors.

You're telling me all the half-baked Marxist theorizing, the musical interludes by Tangerine Dream, and those wooden performances by Jane Birkin really make the originals superior? Plus all that handheld camera shots just give me a stomachache. They're totally dated. At least the American remakes had a bunch of Van Halen on the soundtrack.

Also, the video game is awesome.

Okay, I will grant you Jane Birkin was pretty bad in it. But Serge Gainsbourg kicked ass!

arguing with the regulars....might as well try an get them to embrace breakfast sausage?

Eh. The regulars got their licks in, but I'm still standing. (He said, rather quixotically.)

I'm more of a Malt-O-Meal kinda guy anyway.

The regulars got their licks in, but I'm still standing

That's what she said.

i was gonna tell Kurtis to give it up as well....

you have to try Early's smoked breakfast sausage. You'll embrace the **** out of this stuff.

You don't count, Dougnuts cuz' you're a slutty with your hugs. You'll hug anyone.

you're a slutty with your hugs. You'll hug anyone.

I was hoping for a MNSpeak group-hug earlier... Holy cow, I am a hug slut!

"i was gonna tell Kurtis to give it up as well...."

Like I would have listened. Pttht.

nnoooo, I don't think arthappy passed on Tuecer's mom at all.

Sorry. I don't do Teucer's mom jokes. Though I do sometimes wonder what her stance is on the issue of herd mentality.

So you're saying she takes a wide enough stance with the herd that she milks the issue for some sort of rich creamy reward?

What's all this then?

So you're saying she takes a wide enough stance with the herd that she milks the issue for some sort of rich creamy reward?

»» Submitted by »»» arthappy at 3:15 PM on June 30

oooooo, Teucer's mom jokes....soooo delectable and full of that come hither herd juice you just couldn't leave it alone. tsk tsk arthappy.

I know... I'm ashamed.
Especially because they're pretty pathetic jokes too. Now you know why I stay away from them.

Especially because they're pretty pathetic jokes too.

But now you know why we all enjoy the flavor.

"come hither herd juice"

yup, kinda like a salt lick.

Goes well with beer.

for you alie, a triple, and you should drop it in your beer.

it doesn't foam,

it sparkles.

Pour? Herd juice is meant to be succled.

Heyoooo!

You rubbed one off while hugging my wife? Dirty.

Lately, I've been taking 100mcg of Biotin and a Flax Seed Oil pill and I find that to give me tons of energy without the jittery aftereffects.

I think we called the homebrew "Uncle Nathan's Healthful Youth Elixir," in honor of my brother Nate, who died testing it.

Well, he didn't die, but we did have to call the poison control center.

And the Pimp Juice was totally in season. Nelly rolled it out to capitalize on "Hot In Herr," remember. So it was fresh.

For '88. Suckas.

Ah, that was a good pimp juice vintage. Up there with the 83 Laffite L Cool J and the 79 Louis Jadot Jam Master Jay.

I'm going to go mix me up a gin Kangaroo and make up a list of my mid-year resolutions.

I was about to ask the same thing, Martin.

Is it this (courtesy the internet):

A kangaroo goes into a bar and orders a gin and tonic.
Bartender: "Its £15...I must say, we don't see many kangaroos in here."
Kangaroo: "I'm not surprised. Fifteen quid for a gin and tonic!"

Sailor Martin is a cocktail purist?
I thought sailors pretty much drank whatever you put in front of them.
Even if it's come hither herd juice...

It's amazing the creep can even tell the difference between drinks anymore.

You know what you did. I don't think my heart will ever heal.

But god damnit, I still love you.

I've gone all emo.

A cocktail purist lush... Sailor Martin seems like quite the contradiction.
What else?

doesn't want everyone to know.*

"A cocktail purist lush... Sailor Martin seems like quite the contradiction."

He's a purist for mixological nomenclature. He'll drink any goddamned thing, but heaven help you if call it by the wrong name. He once broke a bottle over my head because I used sour mix instead of simple syrup and freshly squeezed lemon in a Whiskey Sour. He yelled, "If I wanted a goddamned highball I would have ordered a goddamned highball!" Then he drank it.

I'm weeping into my freshly mashed strawberries...

I'm weeping into my freshly mashed strawberries...

Mashed strawberries, what the hell? Did you misplace your dentures?

Either eat them whole, or slice and mix them with red grapes, fresh blueberries and blackberries.

Makin' jam David... makin' jam.

I mix strawberries with 2 Tbsps of sugar and a few healthy splashes of Balsamic...spoon liberally over vanilla ice cream.

This is why Brits have bad teeth. I saw them doing this at Wimbledon. You're going to be on that show.

"No jam club"

but there is the come hither herd juice,
maybe if you let it set long enough it might congeal,
then beat it with a club.

might work.

The brits don't care. Neither does your teeth enamel.

Sailor Martin can get very sensitive about the term 'mashed berries', since that time in Tijuana.

I'd be joining you kwatt.

JACC, cross your fingers... I'm cooling right now. If this doesn't work, we're going to fill up your pool with vanilla ice cream and strawberry syrup.

Yes and yes.

Wait, who's wearing the bikini??

Well we'd clearly be doing it by now (I'm kinda frisky) so once again max steps in with the cock block.

Well, since Matt technically owns the site, I think the cock blocking blame should land squarely on his shoulders.

Ooh, the rare double cock block. Hopefully you won't have to break out the fabled 18 fingers of block.

Although my sensei taught me that technique, he made me promise never to use it except in the direst of circumstances.

More about my sensei.

mb- dude, you're missing out.

Kev consider yourself lucky, the alternative to the Matt and Max cock block would have just left you wondering if they'd ever call.

Kev consider yourself lucky, the alternative to the Matt and Max cock block would have just left you wondering if they'd ever call.