Secrets of the City

On the one hand, it seems silly to arrest these people. But come on. Why not identify yourself? The article said they didn’t because they didn’t know what would happen? What do you think’s going to happen if police ask you to identify yourself when you’re wearing clown makeup and have wires coming out a backpack? You’re gonna get arrested.

Attention people who like to do crazy things in public: identify yourselves to police. It’s not that scary.

It seems odd that they were arrested for possibly having WMD’s but were free to walk to the police precinct before being searched or arrested.

It’s fairly obvious that the police didn’t think they were a real threat if they let them walk into the station with their “bombs” still strapped to their backs.

And the ridiculous argument about an alert about other people in make-up attacking and robbing people. This stupid story was an isolated incident of juggulos in some backass town in another state robbing drunks in a closed park after curfew. These officers need to seriously be reprimanded for taking themselves off the street for so long to harass some kids.

What happens to lead someone to thinking this would be a funny thing to do?

I think both are at fault. There seems to be a trend lately with Minneapolis law-enforcers refusing to be forthcoming with what they’re questioning/arresting someone for. Citizens do have a right to know why they are being questioned by police and/or arrested. However, why give fuel to the fire by refusing to show identification?

However, I also feel that all of this could have been easily solved with a dance-off. Then we would all know who was really 2 legit 2 quit.

kwatt apparently doesn’t know how to have fun.

The equation is simple: Zombies = Fun

The moral of the story is, it’s generally not illegal to be stupid, but in some settings, it is.

Zombie dance off? Seems a little too 1984 for me.

Well that might be really cool in retrospect.

actually Amber, you don’t have a “right” to know why you are being questioned. Although there does have to be a proper reason to be detained, and you do have a right to know why you are being arrested.

Why does this post say “kids”? The news report says six adults.

From reading this article, it sounds like these folks intentionally made suspicious-looking devices. I have absolutely no problem with them being investigated. Even if the fuzz knew they were non-working, fake bombs on public streets became unfunny in, like, 1957.

(Besides, an experienced officer knows it’s probably nothing more than a spectacle, but some people on the street are going to be disturbed/frightened/concerned by this and dial 911)

Also, did know it is illegal to conceal your identity in public in Minnesota?

Not really illegal to be stupid, as they weren’t charged. So it’s just irritating to be stupid. I agree with Amber: a dance-off solves just about everything.

Is there actually any law saying you have to offer up id to cops without a warrant? I know they’d probably say “probable cause!” on this, but come on.

Seriously, papers please?

Yes, papers, please.

Their mistake was not having a Fresh Prince dance party:

I can’t be the only one here who thinks it’s just good policy to arrest zombies. I mean, what if they were real zombies?

Anyone under 25 is a kid.

It didn’t say minors or juveniles which have legal definitions.

A person whose identity is concealed by the person in a
public place by means of a robe, mask, or other disguise, unless
based on religious beliefs, or incidental to amusement,
entertainment, protection from weather, or medical treatment, is
guilty of a misdemeanor.

I’m fairly sure this would fall under the amusement exception.

I love the fact these asshats wouldn’t reveal their identities, but obediently shambled after the cops down to the First Precinct. Way to fight the power, morons!

Wow, Thriller AND Carlton dancing. What a great morning!

hmm, tmayhem, what do you think is going to happen (in the real world) if an officer has articulable suspicion (probable cause isn’t even necessary) to question you in public and you say “no”?

ah yes, the Hibel case. What an awful decision that was!

But then again, I don’t think there was really proable cause here anyway, just cops being dicks.

and from the article:

Police say the group was uncooperative and intimidated passersby with their “ghoulish” makeup at a time when officers were on high alert in reaction to a bulletin about men in other states who wear clown makeup while attacking and robbing people, said Inspector Janee Harteau.

JUGGALOS!

Yeah Tmay, I linked to that Juggalos story at 8:05 am!

I don’t think the “zombies” had much experience with the real world.

ah yes, the Hibel case. What an awful decision that was!

what, exactly, was awful about it? I’d really like to hear your perspective.

Do they put the police on alert everytime there is a crime reported on Drudge Report?

No wonder they don’t have time to investigate any actual crimes they are all on high alert looking for juggalos.

I’m shocked at the lack of either Kevin Bacon or John Lithgow in these comments.

Technically, it’s true. People don’t have the legal right to know why they’re being questioned. And the zombies absolutely needed to get their heads out of their collective asses. However, when Minneapolis cops are called to the mat time and time again regarding their relationship with the community, it might be a good idea to treat people, even people you’re planning to arrest, with respect.

It’s obvious why there was no dance off though — the cops knew they’d get served.

All this crap about “makeshift radios” and wires sticking out of bags makes me wonder…

I didn’t see them or their radios, but it sounds like they just hooked up some batteries to the radio. No big deal.

Are the cops going to try to bust this fall’s Zombie Pub Crawl?

Isn’t it obvious that Cops Rock they don’t dance?

Well they didn’t rock long either!

In related news, Zombie Pub Crawl 2: 329 Days Later is scheduled for September 9.

I mentioned Kevin Bacon when this was discussed yesterday:

Whoa, was Kevin Bacon in the bunch?

Ah, Kenny Loggins and Kevin Bacon.

My issue is more with the fact that it’s acceptable to arrest people for not having identification on them, even if they’re not really suspected of any crime. I don’t think that was the case here, but it seems to be in general. What if you don’t carry an ID on you at all times? There’s no law stating that you must do so, yet you can be arrested for failing to present such an ID to the police if asked to do so. No thanks, police state.

tmay, I think you aren’t distinguishing between what is lawful and what happens in practice. There are very specific situations in Minnesota where it is a violation for not having an ID — driving, carrying a gun. But in general, not having an ID is not against the law.

But again — real world — if cops can reasonably articulate why they are stopping you because something is not right with the situation, and ask you questions to help them determine what is going on, and you say, “I’m not providing an ID, telling you who I am, or telling you what I’m doing” well, yeah, you’re asking for trouble.

The thing about them following them to the precint is weird though . . .

Wayne, it wasn’t a question of presenting ID. It was a question of not identifying themselves at all. If you’re so mind-bogglingly out of touch with reality that you won’t even give your name to a cop, you shouldn’t act surprised when said cop hauls your undead ass in. That said, the cops really need to act like professionals — let people know why they’re being questioned, not use unnecessary force. You know, that whole “don’t be a dick” thing.

richq, I’m with you most of the way about the “don’t be a dick” thing, but I’m not sure telling people why you are questioning them always falls into that category (in fact it might just be counter productive in more ways than one). I’m guessing it wouldn’t have made a bit of difference if the cops told them why they were being stopped. However, I bet it would have made a lot of difference if the cops had a different attitude.

I guarantee it was the combination of the cops’ attitudes and the zombies’ complete disregard of authority that the situation turned out the way it did. That and the fact that they were zombies, of course.

This thread has some of my favorite lines in last coupla months or so:

“And the zombies absolutely needed to get their heads out of their collective asses.”

“…the zombies’ complete disregard of authority…”

“… you shouldn’t act surprised when said cop hauls your undead ass in.”

zombies = teh funny.

No, I know detaining someone for not presenting ID alone is illegal, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen, which I find completely unacceptable. I just wish the lawmen who are supposed to be enforcing the law might follow it a little better sometimes.

You are making rather blanket statements for something that requires specifics — what do you mean by “detain”? Arrest? Sure.

However, if you are talking about stopping someone on the street — a “Terry stop” — it has to be very rare that cops are randomly approaching people, demanding IDs and then holding them for not producing IDs. Rather, people, for a number of reasons, attract the attention of the fuzz, get stopped and then are asked to produce ID. Again, if the cop has good reason to try and identify who you are and what you are doing, they can hold you up.

There are a ton of other variables that come into play, but really, it does make intuitive sense, doesn’t it? I mean, just reverse the situation: a cop approaches a zombie because they have bomb-looking devices and are acting “strange” — and ask them, among other questions, to identify themselves. After chewing off an arm, the zombies say, “No” so the officer says “Okay, then. Very well. Have a good day.”

Right on, mike s.

The zombies have gotten more than their 15 minutes of fame. I mean, that’s not exactly subversive, but whatever. Oh, to be young and discordian, and contrarian, and all that.

Well the zombies had been approached earlier by police and just told to turn their radios down. So obviously different enforcement strategies were being employed by the various MPD officers.

Any chance any of these officers were State Patrol on temporary assignment downtown?

btw, if these are the same zombies that were in the mall of america, they were actually out there protesting corporate and consumer zombies, which makes this night of the undead even better.

Darcy Pohland’s got the big interview with the zombies, and she’ll have a story on WCCO tonight at six!

I watch Good Eats! at 6. When do they post the stories on the website?

You are a cold-hearted mofo, Simpleton. Good eats over Darcy.

Hey, I’ve just had an idea for a title of a show.

I really don’t care how the little zombies were treated, but they damn well had better not have contributed to the delayed police response to this abandoned baby.

That is harsh Simpleton. I’ll see if I can get them to put it up quickly. No promises, though.

I suppose I could DVR Good Eats! today.

But this is an exception, don’t make it a habit!

The zombies made Wonkette! Drudge can’t be far behind!
http://www.wonkette.com/

Another example of how this city is becoming “too safe”. I’m glad I got out. when there are shoot outs in uptown and downtown and some harmless revelers are arrested for for having a good time, the city has its priorities in a mess. I fear for the future.

actually, this is zealousness is probably directly related to a no-tolerance crackdown because of outcry over shootings — sorry, can’t have it both ways (your comment doesn’t even make any sense anyway).

More here (on BoingBoing) and here (on KSTP).

KSTP has pictures:

WHY IS THE UNDEAD CORPSE OF ADAM DURITZ TERRORIZING OUR FAIR CITY?!?!?!?!

well, that didn’t work. damn zombies.

Jamie Lee Jones is the best looking zombie.

The government shouldn’t have the right to harrass you for not having ID. The report doesn’t state if the officer asked their names or demanded ID. Frequently, “identify yourself” actually means PAPERS PLEASE! (da, mein herr!) not just stating “my name is John Smith”

Examples of this are found on The Identity Project.

Greetings fellow Freepers!

I guess there was some confusion. See, I sometimes post on this liberal, homosexual site called mnspeak as part of our campaign to troll on every website with a comment function. I guess there was too much buildup on my manly, non-homosexual glasses this morning and somehow I accidentally posted the above story about the terrorists on our site instead. Anyway, thanks for not being too upset by my mistake. When I get this posted on the right website, those Hilary-loving Islamofascist-appeasing homosexuals won’t know what hit ‘em!

The article does seem to make it clear that the cops asked for IDs, not just names:

“…two officers approached, asked for identification and refused to say why they were being questioned, Kibby said. “We should have had an explanation as to why [they wanted our identification] and they weren’t giving it to us,” she said.”

Here’s Darcy’s story.

You’ve missed a very important fact. We’ve all seen how the police react and deal with suspicious or abandoned luggage, backpacks, packages, etc. Clear the area, set up a police tape perimeter and wait for the bomb squad. This is the process regardless of whether the ‘bomb’ is in someone’s posession or not. If the police thought for a second that there might be a bomb, they would not have approaced the zombies at all. The fact that they were not all face down and being given orders via a bullhorn or police chopper means the police did not consider there to be any bombs from the start. As for the “clown robbers” baloney, sorry police dept, I do not think any able minded person would compare the zombie attire or makeup to clowns, and would like to think that police officers are able minded. That leaves just one conclusion. Roscoe P and the boys were simply harassing some innocent citizens who dared to be different. Abusing their authority while sacrificing public respect. Parents everywhere may want to retain an attorney ASAP. After all, Halloween is just around the corner.

The zombies have gotten their stuff back, including the camera which took pictures of the offending dance party.

Kate took pictures of the zombie dance party as well as the offending weapons of mass destruction that they recieved back after a lengthy going-over by the minneapolis bomb squad.

lessons learned: if you go outside and the police think you look weird or don’t like you, you can be arrested for at least 36 hours on some bogus charge. Afterwards you may or may not ever be able to travel on an airplane or go to another country ever again.

HOORAY AMERICA.

the zombies are free.

In China, this would make sense. In Cuba, sure. In Russia, well, not if you have any money.

In the US, this is a very scary sign that freedom is only OK as long as you don’t try to use it. Disgusting.

I think Amy Klobuchar should have a political ad showing how she’s protecting the citizens of Hennepin county against all enemies, foreign or domestic zombie.

So some of the comments in this thread are really fucked up. You assumed waaaay too much about police. We NEVER intended to make anything look like “weapons of mass destruction.” That’s fucking rediculous. The cops detained us for hours before they could figure out what to slap on us. They knew they weren’t bombs because they were tearing up our shit before the bomb squad got there. The first precinct sargent on duty on sat. night ordered our arrests to all squads downtown, and up on our (7 people, not 6–one minor) COOPOERATIVE arrival with 2! officers from a few blocks away (unhandcuffed, without telling us what we’re being charged with) proceded to tell us that he would put a bullet between our eyes next time he would see us (told us seperately individually as we were being loaded into the paddy waggon two hours after being detained) after first telling us that he “dosn’t give a damn about our constitutional rights.” So yeah. The police always tell the truth. You know it, baby.

Brains?

Did you see th emug shots? How did the lead singer of the counting crows get mixed up with these guys… and poor Jamee Rae she could do better than this rag tag bunch

You Minneapolis people who support your lamebrain cops are sick, sick, sick. Did you REALLY like paying $100,000 to Charlie trunk? Will you ever learn?

I hope they sue your dumb asses into oblivion

Dollars to donuts these people come from upper-middleclass families.

so “booger, zombie 7 folker” if you are one of the Zombie 7, and what you are saying about the cops saying things about bullets between the eyes and constitutional rights is true, why hasn’t that been in any of the news stories?

I saw you all on teevee last night and I didn’t hear any of you say anything like that. I’m not saying it didn’t happen; I’m wondering why this is the first I’m hearing that, as it makes the cops’ conduct appear about 10x worse than I’ve previously heard.

Based on everything I’ve ever read about zombies, I am pretty sure the most prudent reaction to a zombie is a bullet between the eyes.

(For example, here we learn, “IT IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT THAT ZOMBIES BE HIT IN THE HEAD ONLY. CENTER-MASS OR EXTREMITY HITS MAY SLOW DOWN, BUT WILL NOT DISABLE, ONCOMING ZOMBIES. BLOWING OFF ZOMBIE LIMBS MAY PROVIDE GRATIFICATION, BUT FAILURE TO DISABLE A ZOMBIE COULD COST YOU OR YOUR BUDDY’S LIFE.”)

Let me be the first, then, to applaud the MPD not only on their knowledge of these tactics but their apparent use of discretion re when to employ them.

Well me…This is the first you have heard anything that wasn’t edited. Think about that for a moment. I’m not accusing anyone of intentionally skewing the remarks or cutting something but with time and space restraints things can be left out of news reports.

ah, simpleton, don’t you think “bullet between the eyes” and “don’t care about your constitutional rights” is pretty central to this (way-overblown) news story? I can think of a few reasons it would be left out, but one is not “time and space restrains”. I heard a half a dozen quotes last night from the Zombies, and none of them came close to the impact/relevance of the above.

Homemade WMD shopping list:

I-pod
speaker wire
speakers
energy drink
cardboard box
water bottle
car stereo faceplate

derusha, can you ask Darcy if she heard those quotes from the Zombies when she interviewed them?

Hey, she’s kinda cute … for a zombie, I mean.

These guys are a bigger waste of time than the Critical Mass goofballs.

All they wanted was to drink some alcoholic energy drinks and groove to some Zombie Music. Why can’t we just let them be!

Sure, I’ll ask. I’m sure there were a million things said that didn’t make the cut. The story was only 1:30, 90 seconds long.

No mike, there’s a big difference between juggalos and zombies.

also, seriously, can someone in the know get me the girl in that photo I posted’s number?

careful now.

877-BRAAINS.

*rimshot*

what’s there to be careful over? she can eat my brains!

Is anyone else annoyed that those hippies don’t even look like zombies?

Maybe hippie zombies don’t deteriorate, due to the super-saturation of weed, patchouli, and myopia?

I was looking at the pictures. It came to no surprise on of them was a fat chick. There’s one in every crowd like that. Or maybe she was just bloated. You know, from death.

yeah but the one in my picture is cute!

A footnote to all this…

A Google search of the phrase “simulated weaspons of mass destruction” turns up only Minnesota law.

Maybe they marinate their bud in formaldehyde.

maybe it’s because you misspelled weapons.

i think the non-zombie looking pictures are from after they were let out, with blood and scars removed.

Sure, I’ll ask. I’m sure there were a million things said that didn’t make the cut. The story was only 1:30, 90 seconds long.

I knew there was something about TV news that bothered me. It doesn’t have much news.

This from “KatieC”.

Ha Foster! I’m not sure how “newsy” the zombie story is… are you advocating a longer in-depth story on the zombie arrest? Really?

I have a request!!!!

Jason, could you pretty please find the person who put up the big flashy STORM WATCH graphic during last night’s appearance of Tapes ‘N Tapes on Letterman, and kick them in the jimmy for screwing up the broadcast of a local band so people could be informed of the possibility of strong winds and heavy rain in Wisconsin?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Yeah…now tapes n tapes 15 minutes of fame have been letterboxed down to about 11 minutes and 30 seconds.

I share in your disgust with said graphic. At least we just put up a lower-third thing, instead of a box that covers the left side of the screen too. I was watching.

quit holding out and draw another breath

RIP Joe Strummer.

well, i’m glad we got down to the bottom of that “bullet between the eyes” deal. where’s Paul Demko when I need him?

Ugh, “simulated weapons of mass destruction.”

I got one of those.

Ha Foster! I’m not sure how “newsy” the zombie story is… are you advocating a longer in-depth story on the zombie arrest? Really?

What I’m advocating is a Kessler “Reality Check” segment on the actual zombie content of this group. I want blood drawn! Get Shaun (of the Dead) to bring his cricket bat!

Pft.

I see no problem with dressing like zombies and roleplaying, since it’s a part of subculture.

Buuuuut, the problem is when you just don’t settle in with reality.. nothin wrong with playing with your friends but if the police are involved it’s just a good idea to work with them instead of against them.

I like to do improv myself, and if I were ever to take an act to the street I’d try to be cooperative as possible.

They seemed pretty cool to us. We actually had a chance to do a video interview with 3 of the seven that were arrested.( yes there were 7 , the police didnt state that, because the 7th one was a minor. We had a chance to speak with him also.)We had caught up with them , Christian Ute , Marie Kibbe and Kyle Kibbe while we were filiming the Zombie Pub Crawl 06 in Minneapolis.We’re a small film company (bxfilms.com) that covers interesting stories. You get a chance check it out.Just go to our homepage and click on the Download link.