Secrets of the City

More over at D.U. Nation.

This says it all:
“I’ve got to be a realist,” said Quest manager James Ryan. “If you’re somebody who wants to listen to someone who talks about social destruction, I have to assume part of your life is about that. As far as [future] rap concerts go, I’m not going to make promises to anyone.”

what’s he going to do? sensor the lyrics of everyone’s songs?

fear does scary things to peoples’ minds.

Doesn’t the Quest manager realize it’s the drunk jocks from the suburbs who pose the greatest threat of violence in downtown Minneapolis? At least that’s what the people on this site were telling me a few months ago.

Cal, you’re funny. Which high school do you go to?

Wow imagreen, I find that you’re a bit scary. The point is not censorship but a guy that onws a club saying “Gee, I think I’ll book bands that don’t glamorize destruction and bands where the fans aren’t shooting each other.”

you say what you have to say in the days after the shit comes down.

the qwest has to keep their heads low and their noses clean for a few months

I agree with Mark. Imagreen and Cal are totally missing the point.

sounds like jo jo’s got the makings of a good rap song there.

from what mr. ryan was quoted as saying, it sounds like first amendment rights could be threatened for some bands who want to get gigs at the quest. either that, or some form of music genre profiling.

this brings up a touchy subject: does glamorizing violence encourage violence?

imagreen, last time I checked The Quest is private property.
Sounds like you’ve gone to the ACLU school of law.

I need no further evidence that hip-hop/rap encourages violence.

imagreen, the first amendment addresses censorship by the government, not by private business owners. Censorship by business owners is not illegal. We may disagree with it, protest, boycott, whatever. But invoking the first amendment is incorrect.

whatever. i just think it’s lame that the quest would even consider banning certain types of music.

So CCO didn’t even get right the basic facts of the story (that the shooting occurred outside)?

That’s pretty bad.

thank God we live in a country that allows people to decide for themselves what they want to have in there club. imagreen, can i come over, sit in your house and make you listen to whatever music you don’t like?

I’ll bet you’ve got a Wellstone bumper sticker on your Subaru don’t you?

“Never go to clubs with metal detectors. Sure it feels safe inside. But what about all those niggas waiting outside with guns? They know you ain’t got one.”
- chris rock

holy shit jesus pete, i’m thinkin why are those photos out there? no one’s gotten on you about that yet? is that not a bad thing? dude…

no you can’t come over mark, the steel plate in your head would set off the metal detector at the door.

jeanfid, settle down, its what the rappas are dealin’ with all day and imagreen wants to shove down your throught. decency and decorum, ha ha welcome to hip hp culture. it’s apparently the latest greatest thing, jump on the bandwagon

no, i’m just looking at it from a journalistic standpoint. that blog is connected to a larger website; basically, i’m surprised they haven’t shut him down for posting it.

beyond that, i ain’t that desensitized. it may be a daily thing for some, but i wish it weren’t. but that’s just me man.

Why don’t we shift the discussion to why people like Mark capitalize on these tragedies to make generalizations about hip-hop, the ACLU, and liberals?

why not? seems to me that I’m an observer of the actions of others that appear to be out of balance wth common sense, decency, and a bizarre sense of purpose. I have no reason to capitalize, since I have no hidden agenda to make money, spread a self-serving message or impose my will on others.

mike???

“Rappas”? Oh, I think I had that at a Spanish restaurant… No, that was tappas. or is it tapas. Anyway, I was thinking that we should actually start banning some music, because seriously, Nickelback? Come on, how in god’s name can they exist? And then there is Phil Collins and John Tesh… Oh Tesh, man don’t even start me on Tesh. That guy’s more overrated than Bach, who was a hack by the way…
So back to the point. I was totally going to go listen to some rappa music. But then I realized that it’s all violent and I would either get shot or want to shoot someone… phew. Thank god I can fall back on my good old fashioned rock ‘n’ roll. Give me some sexual innuendo! “Cherry Pie”? Alright!

What’s with all of the WCCO plugs? …us other guys could use some love, too.

Uhhhh, I’m not sure that’s a good “plug” for WCCO.

Mark, right on brother, don’t let the PC thought police get you down.

Quest and that crowd of theirs are both, uh, rather bad news.

End of story.

Wouldn’t want this spilling over into Holidazzle!

Bud is the Stephen Colbert of MNspeak, but not as funny.

New T-shirt idea:

“Shotgun, bitch!”

Thanks, rex.

I think….

Another Lil’ Flip photo in CP Viewmaster.

Thanks for the link, Rex.

I need no further evidence that hip-hop/rap encourages violence.

I need no further evidence that linking my articles encourages stupidity.

That James Ryan quote is loathesome. “If you’re somebody who wants to listen to someone who talks about social destruction, I have to assume part of your life is about that.” What a slap in the face to the hundreds of people who were there and had nothing to do with what happened. They waited outside in the cold, paid their $20, danced, bought drinks, and otherwise bided their time for hours until the headliner finally came on at 1:30. When fights broke out after that, security was NOT THERE FOR THEM, at least not in the way I’m used to seeing. After the shooting, when people were told they couldn’t leave the building, they just patiently waited some more.

Music fans are not what they listen to. I talked to fans at Young Jeezy who hate drug dealers–and Jeezy talks about nothing but drug dealing! You can take an educated guess and say that music appealing massively to the “hood” will inevitably draw a few people who have violence in their lives. That doesn’t mean the violence always spills over into concerts. Shows happen all the time without you hearing about them because nothing bad happened.

Jeanfid, I don’t follow what you’re saying.

Geez! Here up Nort Rapping is what we do wit crappies before we put dem in da freezer?

Pete, you had me thinking but then you said: “security was NOT THERE FOR THEM”. You appear to have been infected by notion that is so popular in these times: “It’s always someone elses fault.” What’s you’re accusation? That becasue it was a rap band, the Quest purposely had light security. The Quest is racist? You’re up to two reasons for why it’s someone elses fault. C’mon, let’s go for three.

Hey “Bleeding Heart” Scholtes:

Please expand on your thoughts regarding “Shotgun, bitch!”.

Thank you.

BTW, Bon Jovi rocks.

I say, ban Liz Phair!

pete writes what we all know when we’re 16 but seem to forget once we’re over the age of about 28-30. music may in some ways define who we are, but it does not necessarily induce specific behavior, and his comments do not infer that he is anything more than a music lover.

pete, the bloody photo was just incredibly graphic, and i was surprised it was posted on your site. that’s all.

Youll take Liz Phair away when you pry her from my cold dead fingers!

RE: the photo.

I’m pretty sure no other publication or tv station would run images of shooting victims outside bars. Does that mean I think it’s a bad idea? Not really. I think what’s interesting here is that a blog (even a blog under the name of a media outlet) can “get away” with running these kinds of photos. And you can only bet that you’ll see more and more of this as owning a digi cam (and having a publishing mechanism) becomes as common as owning shoes.

It’s a shame that such a photograph like that is put out for public consumption. I feel sorry for the victim and the victim’s family. I was on one of the NWA planes that crashed into the other plane on the runway earlier this year. As we were evacuating the plane, lots of people were snapping pictures of the crash with their camera phones. As I was watched people doing this my first reaction was that I couldn’t do something like that since we didn’t know if the pilots or flight attendents were hurt or not. It seemed morbid to me to take the pictures. Not sure why.

bizactly. i did not mean to imply that you shouldn’t link to it or that pete shouldn’t post it. just flipped when i saw it. you mnspeaker mainstays are always on the edge. i guess if i wanna run with the wolves i gotta learn how to bite…

Here are my thoughts on the photo. First of all, it’s not a picture of a shooting victim outside. It’s of a person who was wounded during a fight inside, the man described in the opening paragraph who later walked out of the club. I didn’t think to take that photo until I felt sure he was “okay.” He had tried to get up but was encouraged to lay down. He was talking and walking, in other words. I was in a mild state of shock, so I was acting mostly on instinct.

A phone call to the police on Monday made it clear that this particular incident was not under police investigation. After the art director downloaded the photo, I could see that the victim’s face was obscured. To me, what registers is the emotion and body language around him. This seemed worth making public.

I’ve been the victim of several violent crimes. I hope I’m tuned-in to the post-traumatic stress of people watching their tragedy play out in the media. The day after I was attacked by a crackhead in New Orleans in 1995, a copy of the Nation arrived with the headline “One Violent Crime.” It was an editorial by a victim who felt attacked all over again when his image became a propaganda tool in the crime war. The article opened: “Alone in my home I am staring at the television screen and shouting. On the evening local news I have unexpectedly encountered video footage, several months old, of myself writhing on an ambulance gurney…”

It would be a nightmare come true for me if this piece further afflicts the afflicted. I can already tell it comforts the comfortable.

As for quoting that woman, Bud: I wish I hadn’t. It became a headline at Fraters Libertas, letting loose a torrent of racist bile into my blog comments–the administrator has deleted at least six of the more blatant ones so far.

Mark, I didn’t say any of the things you accuse me of, so I’m not sure what to respond to. I have no idea why security seemed light that night. And the Quest has been such a huge proponent of black music, salsa, dancehall, etc. that I’ll leave your comment about racism untouched.

My point was that Ryan might have good reason to change the subject. And since your hearts don’t bleed, I hope y’all recognize somebody not taking responsibility when you read it.

As I said on the DUNation board, the violent behavior was pathetic and disgusting. It was obviously the fault of those who initiated it and prolonged it. Most everyone else at the show felt the same way, judging by what they said, and the looks on their faces.

Why would anyone assume otherwise? Because of lyrics? Incidents at other shows? Let’s see, now, this is a tough one…

Sounds like you did all the right things before posting the picture. Nice job.

Ah, thanks for all the clarifications, Pete.

Pete:

You ‘wish you hadn’t’ quoted the woman?

WHY would you censor what seems to be the most compelling element in describing the mindset / behavior of this lovely crowd, for that matter, this entire ‘genre’ of ‘entertainment’.

It is a sad reminder of how much downtown specifically and Minneapolis in general have changed – FOR THE WORST.

Rex, the t-shirt, please!

WHY would you censor what seems to be the most compelling element in describing the mindset / behavior of this lovely crowd, for that matter, this entire ‘genre’ of ‘entertainment’.

Asked and answered in one question!