Secrets of the City

Who sent you? What’s your motivation? Do any of you guys know this jpix person? Are you looking through my laundry hamper?

(kidding)

Short answer — coming to MNspeak is a good start. We have “first evar” [sic] get togethers from time to time so folks can meet each other in person or just catch up with the ones they already know offline. As far as whether Minnesotans area easier to get to know, I’ll let people transplanted from farther than the next state over (I’m from North Dakota) speak to that one.

everyone is very guarded and suspicious of each other. I’m hoping MN will be an improvement.

well, this wouldn’t be my first choice for “least guarded and suspicious populace” but here’s a comparison based on my somewhat limited knowledge of Utah:

1) our liquor laws are a marginal improvement.
2) our women are prettier, but less procreatively prolific.
3) our wingnuts are not as well armed.
4) our mountains don’t exist.
5) our winters are colder and longer, but have less snow.

I only lived in SLC for a year but grote’s comparison seems pretty much accurate.

Spent our whole vacation in Utah this year. Really enjoyed it. And I thought the people were really friendly. I imagine it might be a hard place to live, though.

We’re like other people, only moreso.

You may hear a bunch of different opinions, if people latch on to this thread. Everyone likes to talk about this place.

Well, there’s this old story about a new couple that arrives in town and they’re wondering if they’ll like it, so they go to see the oldest resident in town. They ask him what the people are like in their new town. He says, what were they like where you come from? Oh, they were lovely, the couple says. Everyone was really nice, friendly, and thoughtful. You’ll like it here, the old man says. The people here are the same way. Then another couple comes and they also go see the old man, and they ask him the same question. What were people like in your old home town, he asks. Oh, they were awful, the couple says. They were mean, cold, and selfish. You won’t like it here, the man says sorrowfully. The people here are just like that.

Not trying to be preachy or wise or anything. I just couldn’t help but think of that folksy story and I always liked it.

So what brings you to Minnesota?

jennifer…don’t mind kurtis, he’s really preachy and wise.

Some people will tell you it is very hard to make friends and break into inner circles of native Minnesotans. I hear it all the time. But, my husband and I are both natives and most of our friends aren’t. We may be the exception that proves the rule, but I like to think that really we are welcoming people.

I’m a transplant of 8 years.
It’s the same as anywhere else in the world.
Some people are great, others should be Soylent Green.
Less guarded and less suspicious than Utah? Hardly.
MNSpeak is a perfect example. There are cliques, and some people get shut out, yada,yada, yada.

Bottom line: If you really liked high school, then Minnesota is for you.

You’ll get along fine here as long as you enjoy a good fisting.

Jpix, I moved here from Kansas City about 3 1/2 years ago. It took me about 2 weeks to make friends. It was so easy, but I actively tried to make new friends and took an outgoing approach. I have heard others say that it’s really hard to make friends here, but I never experienced that. I would say I make at least one new friend every month or two, and I never had that experience in KC. If you are willing to look for friends instead of waiting for them to fall into your lap, you will have no trouble at all!

BTW…I love Mpls! Welcome!

You’ll be welcome here as long as you’re not from california. We’ve got way too many people here from california. Especially bakersfield. They should go back.

The “I’m moving to Minneapolis!” thread comes up every couple months and I have to say, having required login on MNspeak really changes things. Will it turn into drivel 10 comments from now? Maybe 1 comment from now?

Oh yeah, Minneapolis. Yeah, everyone is guarded and suspicious of each other. In just a “nicer” way.

Don’t get me wrong though, I seriously love it here.

People are really mean in MN and they yell a lot!

Wait a minute, sandburg. I thought you were deef?

I know a fair number of people from Utah who moved here specifically for school or work and they’ve loved it here. This includes Mormons (from very liberal to very conservative) and non-Mormons.

I’m moving from up north to the great big mystical Minneapolis.
I’ll be your friend, jpix. We northerners are friendlier than city people.

Unless you’re from the city, and in ours. Then you’re a nuisance. (I’m sure they feel the same way about us.)

We’ve been here less than a year. Great place. I like the community involvement, which seems higher than other places I’ve lived.

fuck you too, dennis!
actually I’m not the only person in minneapolis from bakersfield.
I’ve met at least one other person, and I’m sure there are a few others somewhere …

and actually, it’s all the small town people moving to the ‘big city’ that keep their small-town-I’m-still-in-high-school mentality and do all the passive-aggressive cliquey bullshit here. people that grew up in the cities proper are a lot easier to get along with.

actually I’m not the only person in minneapolis from bakersfield.
I’ve met at least one other person, and I’m sure there are a few others somewhere …

Like I said, “they.”

why don’t you take yourself back to whatever bridge you crawled out from under?

There’s a train leaving in about an hour, wayne. For the west coast. You love trains, right?

Here ya go.

Beautiful scenery, I’m sure.

I think this is the sort of thing that’s usually handled after school, behind the gym by the dumpster.

Maz and Wayne are the twisted universe welcoming committee, jpix.

Boys, please take your pissing match elsewhere.

Maz and Wayne are the twisted universe welcoming committee, jpix.

Boys, please take your pissing match elsewhere.

get this–In MN, you can actually walk into a bar on your own accord….
And they aren’t all hidden from view either.

Maz and Wayne are the twisted universe welcoming committee, jpix.

You either take all of Minnesota or none of it.

Ten thousand lakes and a few soreheads.

that dipshit dennis can’t shut his old toothless claptrap about me, even when I’m not around.

if he had any real teeth left I’d knock them out of his head for him.

Now I’d pay to see this. I can host, I have a central Minneapolis location convenient for all.

maz in his prime would have wiped the floor with wayne, but I have a hard time putting my cash on the old man with lumbago. As the official MNSpeak oddsmaker, I currently have Maz an ever so slight (6-5) favorite pending the pre-fight physical and weigh-in.

jpix, neither Maz nor Wayne are indicative of the people you find in the greater Twin Cities area. (But your mileage may vary.) Welcome to MNSpeak!

remember geoff, I do a decent amount of manual labour at my job these days

also: repressed rage

I’ll cover that action.

There’s a train leaving in about an hour, wayne. For the west coast. You love trains, right?

Maz, when are you retiring to Florida with the rest of the Olds?

Maz has more sand than all of Florida.

Couldn’t see him there.

sorry wayne, but guys who spell it “manual labour” don’t come across as very threatening.

Maz has more sand than all of Florida.

Is he storing it up in his vagina?

Insulting a guy’s masculinity while being a woman yourself is kinda Freudian, Ang.

jpix, neither Maz nor Wayne are indicative of the people you find in the greater Twin Cities area. (But your mileage may vary.) Welcome to MNSpeak!

But DouglasG is or lovingly referred to as Dougnuts. Great guy, just don’t trust him to watch your bike.

I have to say my bet is on Wayne – younger and more rageful.

I’m guess Wayne is probably a dirty fighter.

That might tip the scales.

We’d just have to tape little pictures of SUVs, Suburban homes, and crowded highways to Maz, and Wayne would go apeshit on him…

put a sport jersey or hat on him too, for good measure

If you say so, Rat.

This post might as well be titled “What are people like in general?”

We’d just have to tape little pictures of SUVs, Suburban homes, and crowded highways to Maz, and Wayne would go apeshit on him…

Nice!

did rat just accuse ang of being a woman? that ain’t cool, dude.

I’ll put $5 on maz and another $5 that wayne cries.

you want to have a go too, kevin?
bring that bowling ball head over here

At least he didn’t ask for advice on where to live!

God forbid we go down that road again.

That being said I know a nice clean 3 bedroom in the nice part of Robbinsdale for $158K. Any reasonable offer accepted.

It does have a tiled in shuffle board court in the basement and a built in bar.

did rat just accuse ang of being a woman?

Am I wrong?

I want shuffle board in my basement!. That’s sweet.

grote’s just pissed because I can hula hoop better than she can.

Great guy, just don’t trust him to watch your bike.

Ouch! That went straight to the heart!

If it’s a street fight, I go with Wayne, as rage tends to be the most essential ingredient to a good spastic fight.

If it’s something a little more cunning, say a cage match, I think maz gets the nod because of his guile and surliness.

I volunteer to be a round card carrier in a skimpy swim suit.

Ang…for a girl, I hula hoop a lot like a stiff fat old suburban guy.

jpix:

If you move here, don’t show up for the Internet (and it IS The Internet) instigated pillow fights.

That’s just lame.

it’s really a shame I’m so against violence, because this is really starting to sound kind of appealing

That being said I know a nice clean 3 bedroom in the nice part of Robbinsdale for $158K. Any reasonable offer accepted.

I really like the part of Robbinsdale that’s kind of a triangle bounded on the south by 40th on the east by the train tracks and on the west by 100. Community wading pool, beautiful old restored homes, walking distance to shops including Hackenmullers and Wuollet.

This thread fell started falling apart just before 9 a.m. … Damn. I’m late again!

In an effort to rescue things: I like Minnesota a lot. I’ve chosen to stay here for 10 years despite having several chances, and many reasons, to move away.

The only drawback to here is people have this weird inflated, chauvinistic sense of how great things are here. I mean, it’s great and all (there are worse and there are better places; there are good things here, and some bad things)–but it’s not that great.

Since Utah has spectacular winters with all that snow and such varied topography and climates, I think coming to these parts would be a letdown.

Not as much snow and cold. Skiiing is mostly poor. Valleys as much as hills.

I loved that Utah vacation. Good trout streams, not the little farm creeks and small Wisconsin rivers.

I really like the part of Robbinsdale that’s kind of a triangle bounded on the south by 40th on the east by the train tracks and on the west by 100. Community wading pool, beautiful old restored homes, walking distance to shops including Hackenmullers and Wuollet.

The part on the the Parkway bordering Minneapolis is quite nice too. Especially on the end closer to 44th.

I’ll agree with arthappy that minnesotans are way too gung-ho about thinking this place is the shit. Maybe it’s because they’re all from small towns and this is the biggest city they’ve spent much time in (except for that vacation to some other big city that was way too scary and dirty for their tastes). Or maybe it’s a delusional attempt to be satisfied with the shortcomings of this place.

Either way, Minneapolis is cool, but not that cool. I like it here, but it could stand to make some changes.

The only drawback to here is people have this weird inflated, chauvinistic sense of how great things are here. I mean, it’s great and all (there are worse and there are better places; there are good things here, and some bad things)–but it’s not that great.

I agree that there is a kernel of truth to this statement, although I think it misses one key point: Minnesota is significantly better than every other place in the world, except for Sweden.

But other than that oversight, I’d say arthappy was spot on.

For real, Jennifer. This is a wonderful place to live. Here’s a snapshot. Here’s my morning today:
1. Got up and ran 10 minutes to a local lake where I went for a 30 minute swim.
2. Ran home, showered, hopped on my bike, and rode into downtown to work.
3. Stopped by coffee shop (Dunn. Bros. on Loring), watched the world go by, then rode the rest of the way in.

It’s a good, good place.

oh and if you criticize anything, obviously you’re a dirty outsider who needs to go back from whence he came. there’s no room for constructive criticism and a desire to make anything better, because THEY LIKE IT JUST HOW IT IS HERE, THANKS.

Somewhere between Nate and Wayne lies god’s honest truth about this place.

Also, I hate you Nate. Don’t you have kids and a job to worry about?

I’m with Wayne, I mean, everytime I give constructive criticism about how people are delusional small town hicks, they get all defensive and shit.

Let us know when you have some constructive criticism to dispense, wayno.

And your desire to “make things better” seems more a desire to “make things better” for wayne.

Maybe it’s because they’re all from small towns and this is the biggest city they’ve spent much time in (except for that vacation to some other big city that was way too scary and dirty for their tastes).

Wayne, seriously, shut up. How many people are from small towns on here? Like 6? Everyone is from the suburbs or other cities. And, as stated above, there are lots of people from around the country here. And, it isn’t what you say, it is how you say it. I criticize this town often, as do many others, and we agree with you, but we can’t stand your constant angry bitching. You act like you are being held hostage.

You want to talk fashion and minneapolis, well here you go!!! (via rex or however the f*ck you do bloggy attribution)

I’ve always loved the skiing in SLC, and Park City is fun during Sundance. Hotornot.com would argue with G Rote that the ladies are hotter in SLC than Mpls (they rank #9 for hottest women, we’re at #30). However, our men will be a slight improvement for you (#5 in Minneapolis compared with SLC’s #6).

One thing I remember from the few weeks I worked there is a conversation with a SLC librarian. When she saw my license she asked “Oh, you’re from Minnesota? I moved here from there!”

“That’s nice,” I responded, “how do you like it in Salt Lake?”

“You know, I’ve never felt at home here.”

“Well, that should come with time. How long have you lived here?”

“Five years.”

Jpix, I don’t think it will take you that long to feel at home here.

I’ll agree with arthappy that minnesotans are way too gung-ho about thinking this place is the shit. Maybe it’s because they’re all from small towns and this is the biggest city they’ve spent much time in (except for that vacation to some other big city that was way too scary and dirty for their tastes). Or maybe it’s a delusional attempt to be satisfied with the shortcomings of this place.

Yeah, tons of constructive criticism here^^

Wayne is totally the second guy in my story upthread.

I’m not talking about mnspeak, I’m talking about 20somethings in minneapolis in general.

seriously, how many of your average uptown hipsters do you think are from small towns?

the answer is most of them, and they’re notoriously snotty twats

oh and if you criticize anything, obviously you’re a dirty outsider who needs to go back from whence he came. there’s no room for constructive criticism and a desire to make anything better, because THEY LIKE IT JUST HOW IT IS HERE, THANKS.

This is just a shot in the dark, but maybe some locals are just tired of people coming here and bitching about how unlike Chicago, Boston, New York, etc it is. You can only call people backwards yokels so many times before they start getting defensive and quit inviting you to their parties.

Well, it wouldn’t be MNspeak unless Wayne wasn’t melting down over something.

jpix: This thread is a pretty good example of what Minnesotans are like: For the most part reasonable, intelligent, and funny. For every 8-year-old meltdown there are those who will try to corral the 8 year-old and those who support the corraling and then others who will make hotdish for you.

my skin is sloughing off today and I’m in immense pain despite the prescription narcotics. sitting at work while my epidermis comes off does not make me a cheerful friendly guy.

anyway I know I’m being a bit over-the-top today, but people here really are touchy about criticism.

My theory about the local chauvinism is its an attempt to over-position the place against other places. Minneapolis is great and all, but it doesn’t have the wide-ranging cultural options of NYC or LA. It’s not a lovely as San Francisco. It doesn’t have the weather of Atlanta or Miami. It’s not booming like Seattle, or filled with hot young professionals like DC. So, the only thing Minneapolis can do is boast about itself (in a way that none of these places do…) One thing Minneapolis is actually probably best at in the country is self-boosterism; perhaps only Chicago compares, and that city has the same set of insecurities as Mpls.

Why does it matter if they are from small towns Wayne? Who gives a fuck?

Wayne’s now a 7 to 4 underdog.

anyway I know I’m being a bit over-the-top today, but people here really are touchy about criticism.

Maybe you should revisit the tone of some of your criticism (I’m guilty as well, but not surprised when people are touchy about it).

I’m from a small town (about 250 or so.) One of the three finalists on Nashville Star is from an even smaller town a few miles away. Take that, the big city!

If it’s a street fight, I go with Wayne, as rage tends to be the most essential ingredient to a good spastic fight.

If it’s something a little more cunning, say a cage match, I think maz gets the nod because of his guile and surliness.

Interesting. A series of fights is in order, each in a different setting.

How about a fight between Jpix and Wayne–If Jpix wins, Wayne moves back to Boston, and Jpix gets Wayne’s apartment.

If Wayne wins, Wayne moves back to Boston.

wayne, i feel for you. molting is never easy.

kevin is exactly my point about small town folks

So, the only thing Minneapolis can do is boast about itself (in a way that none of these places do…)

Certainly not New York. Shrinking violets, they are.

I don’t even want to move back to Boston right now.

dood…you’re from a dusty polluted farm town in the central valley. get over thineself, posthaste.

I know, and I hate it.
it’s totally possible to get over both the suburban and small town upbringing, but a lot of people never seem to.

You always have an excuse, Wayne. And I don’t know if I would throw down the remark about touchy criticism… something about a pot and a kettle is all.

It’s all in the presentation – cutting someone off at the knees is better done reasonably than with rage. People tend to bristle and shut down when someone’s screaming spittle is hitting them in the face.

Have we said: “Welcom, jpix” yet?

If not, Welcome Jpix.

Or maybe never want to.
?

arthappy proves a point that people from other places are always comparing us to towns twice our size and pointing out how we don’t have the cool stuff they have.

So, if you expect MSP to have all the stuff that New York, Boston, San Fran, etc has, you will be very disappointed. If you realize that the metro area only has a couple million people, you will be very pleased.

You know, I grew up in Minneapolis, and I’ve lived in New York and Los Angeles and New Orleans. I also moved to Omaha for six years, which is smaller than Omaha.

None of that put a chip on my shoulder. I wonder if it’s a Boston thing.

oh yeah, don’t let us scare you off jpix. it’s still a nice place to live.
but everyone on the internet argues.

I wouldn’t trade my childhood–the ability to essentially live in the woods, building forts, exploring, etc, no matter how many Ethiopian restaurants you throw at me.

Just because you like to think of yourself as a big city guy, doesn’t mean the rest of us do. In fact, one of the things I love about Minneapolis is that I can be out of it and in the country in like 30 minutes.

Arthappy, you think Atlanta has great weather? Huh? It’s so hot there. Ick.

I think the Mpls boasting is well deserved. I moved here because I loved it and felt at home the first 5 minutes I was in the city. I have never found a place that combines good value, awesome theater, great arts scene, amazing food, good shopping, friendly people, pretty lakes/parks, community involvement and bike-friendliness in quite the same way. I sometimes think about moving because there are so many places to experience, but I can’t imagine where I would move that would be better than here.

kc, I’m plenty pleased with what we have here, but I don’t think it’s wrong to have aspirations either.

portland is a tiny metro with all sorts of things we could have if we had some real leadership. let’s compare ourselves to portland instead of bigger cities, then.

our economy is stronger, so we should be able to best portland easily. why aren’t we?

Although I do wish Minneapolis had the diveristy that Detroit has…

baker, I actually love when there’s a good city/country dichotomy too. but you start to lose that when you get that icky low-density sprawl that eats up the countryside. denser cities make the country more accessible and less spoiled because it’s right there, isntead of beyond 40 miles of ranch houses and cleared fields.

let’s compare ourselves to portland instead of bigger cities, then.

Oh, please, let’s not…

and my only real gripe with the small-town/suburban mindset is that it’s pretty socially immature in a lot of ways, and not very accepting. that’s the big problem I had when I moved here. some people get over it and are great, but a lot of people don’t seem to around here.

why not, alie?
it’s similarly-sized, of a similarly-progressive mindset, etc.

arthappy proves a point that people from other places are always comparing us to towns twice our size and pointing out how we don’t have the cool stuff they have.

So, if you expect MSP to have all the stuff that New York, Boston, San Fran, etc has, you will be very disappointed. If you realize that the metro area only has a couple million people, you will be very pleased.

My hypothesis was actually the opposite–that locals compare themselves to other places in the hopes they can prove their superiority. But it was just a hypothesis, with little real empirical data. It deserves to be poked through and through.

Much as I don’t care for the boosterism, I still really like this place.

why not, alie?
it’s similarly-sized, of a similarly-progressive mindset, etc.

Because I’m tired of the web’s love affair with Portland…

Much as I don’t care for the boosterism, I still really like this place.

That said, I think things have gotten worse around here of late. Probably mostly due to the economy, but also the politics…

we need a new governor.
badly.

it’s amazing how much one man can do to fuck a place up (much like, well, the president)

and don’t hate on portland because people love it! look to it as a source of inspiration!

I really do like the fact that there don’t seem to be as many hippies here as in other places. I guess they all live up north.

kevin is exactly my point about small town folks

Highlight of my day right thar.

and don’t hate on portland because people love it! look to it as a source of inspiration!

I don’t hate it, I’m just tired of hearing about it.

If it’s cultural diversity your are looking for Minneapolis has Portland beat.

In any event, I’d rather Minneapolis aspire to be an American Toronto any day.

Minneapolis: Fargo
Portland: My Own Private Idaho

Advantage: Minneapolis

Portland: The Decembrists
Minneapolis: The Replacements

Draw

Portland: Beverly Cleary
Minneapolis: Kate Di Camillo

Advantage: Portland

Minneapolis: Mary Tyler Moore Show
Portland: Hello Larry

Advantage: Minneapolis

Minneapolis: Twins, Vikings, and T’Wolves
Oregon: Blazers

Advantage: Minneapolis

Minneapolis: Charles M. Schulz
Portland: Matt Groening

Draw

Overall I think Mpls wins by a nose, but they’re both lovely contestants!

I think Minneapolis should aspire to be a small, land-locked, ice-cold, unsexy Rio.

I’d rather Minneapolis be itself, and not try to be like any other city.

I’m from a semi-small town Wayne, and I am open, accepting, and welcoming to everyone–including people that choose to live in the suburbs.

You seem like a hypocrite in the way you talk about people that don’t choose to live inside the urban centers. You dismiss them as uncaring, unaccepting idiots every chance you get, and to be honest, the city is not for everyone, and it’s about fucking time that you come to grips with that.

I really do like the fact that there don’t seem to be as many hippies here as in other places.

Andyst: According to Urban Dictionary, you would be wrong about the hippie thing. “Minneapolis has an elaborate skyline, surrounded by ugly-ass sculpture parks created by liberals and hippies. Overall, Minneapolis is a nice city.”

Also, jpix, just so you know, according to the same post about Minneapolis on Urban Dictionary, below is everything to hate about Minneapolis. (Note the two comments at the end, and you’ll start to see an emerging pattern…)

9. minneapolis
1. a dumb city in a dumb state that nobady cares about.
2. a place that people think is ghetto cuz they might see black people walking around.
3. a city with no nightlife with the exception of a few bars full of 19 yo skanks
4. worse than chicago by far, detroit, st louis, millwaukee and every other city in the midwest.
5. a downtown with two important aves hennepin and first, everything else is dead.
6. about 75% of the city is actually suburban.
7. The coldest metro area in the continental us, by mean temperature
8. cops are nice compared to other cities (NYPD, LAPD)
9. people drive like idiots and gridlock
10. so cold and snowy that they made skyways to walk around
11. terrible public transportation one train that goes to the mall and back
12. residents who think they live in the best city ever and walk around with 612 hats
13. Once you leave the outskirts of the city all of a sudden you are in the middle of nowhere for the next million miles

MN: MPLS is much better than detroit or chicago!
me: have you ever left this worthless state?

Ha ha! Nice analysis, Kurtis. I like…

baker, my biggest issue is that I see suburbanites as people that either don’t realize or don’t care that their lifestyle is totally untenable and destroying the long-term viability of this country.

that said, not all suburbs are evil. exurbs are definitely bad, but close-in traditionally-built suburbs are just extensions of the city. I’m more upset with the lifestyle which suburbs mandate and the way people come to think of it as the only sensible way of living in america (and thus the only way deserving of any monetary support or investment from the government).

6. about 75% of the city is actually suburban.
[...]
11. terrible public transportation one train that goes to the mall and back

hmmmmmmm.

While I agree that more public transit is always a good thing, I don’t get why ours is perceived as being so horrible. Go spend some time in KC. Then you’ll see horrible, near non-existent public transit. If you choose wisely about your living location, buses will get you most anywhere you want to go. I can’t think of a single place that I go to with any frequency that couldn’t be attained by a bus near to my house. (Or by foot or bike for that matter.)

I know Wayne, but people do a lot of shit we don’t like. But you just have to deal with it, I think they will only change as the younger generations come up. But the fact is, I know alot of people that choose to raise their children in the suburbs, but have lived inside the city for a long time.

that being said, boy there are some idiots on that urban dictionary site…

The aggregate wisdom of crowds is idiocracy, imo. I am for re-intermediation.

I’ll agree with arthappy that minnesotans are way too gung-ho about thinking this place is the shit.

It’s called America.

tara, the transit system isn’t that terrible, it’s just not really adequate for a city this size. just because other places get it even wronger doesn’t excuse us from not doing well enough.
the frequencies are poor on most routes, some areas have inadequate service, signage is terrible, going through downtown at rush hour is a mess, capacity on the busiest lines is inadequate (yet somehow we haven’t converted them to trains yet), etc. etc. etc.

there are so many things that need to be improved, and instead we’re talking about raising fares and cutting service. what the fuck?

I agree that we could benefit from improvements and should be pushing for that. I’m just saying that it’s really not that bad. You can get where you need to go relatively easily if you live in a party of town that is heavily serviced by the bus system. I live right in between the 4 and the 6 so I rarely have trouble getting anywhere in a timely fashion.

wayne, I hope they don’t convert all the busiest lines to trains. we do not want a train in our front yard. Streetcars would work just fine down Nicollet. The rails are still there.

and yes, mt needs a lot of improvement. Some mornings, on my standing room only bus, I wish they would raise the fares, but I know the real answer is to add new buses.

But, comparing it to similar sized cities is a good idea. I can only think of a couple that are better than ours, most are much worse.

right, I live in a well-serviced part of town as well (2/4/6/10/11/17/25 and some expresses), but sometimes it’s a ridiculous hassle to get certain places.
like 30 minute waits for most of the routes on the weekends and evenings? what? even the busiest of them.
and then the 4/6 are exactly the same route from my neighbourhood all through downtown to the walker, yet they come by at the same time during those off times, rather than spacing out 15 minutes from one another so that area has 15 minute frequency instead of 30. why?

a good transit service is one you can use without having to look up the schedules and still get somewhere in an hour. if you spend half an hour just waiting for the damned thing to show up …

I’m all for streetcars for inner-city routes. we could use a few real subways on trunk routes, though.

they can’t use the buried rails, though, kc. they’ve degraded over time and probably wouldn’t support the weight of modern equipment anyway.

still, if they weren’t always fighting the state for enough money to even get by, MT might be able to make some decent improvements.

Could someone please create a greasing the dolphin macro?

Kthxbye.

anyway, the transit system is A-ok for commuting (a bit over capacity on some routes), but inadequate for people who take it the rest of the time (errands, work off-hours, etc)

now I’m done for the day. ciao all.

It’s called America.

hear, hear!

We used to have an extensive street car system throughout the cites. You can still find tracks around town, especially in St. Paul.

But the people decided, correctly, that that mode of transportation was antiquated and opted to convert to a bus system.

The End

Bullshit Maz, the people did not decide…General Motors destroyed the Streetcars of St. Paul as well as many other major American cities. It paved the way for more car purchases and for more extensive use of GM built buses as the main mode of urban mass transit. Stick that in your free market pipe and smoke it.

But the people decided, correctly, that that mode of transportation was antiquated and opted to convert to a bus system.

Wasn’t there a plan to keep both streetcars and buses. Wasn’t that what the scandal was all about.

I’ve ridden streetcars in cities like Amsterdam. They’re slow and clunky. I don’t get wrapped up in the romance.

Try riding them in New Orleans. They’re fabulous.

I’m not wrapped up in the romance of New Orleans, either.

Try riding them in New Orleans. They’re fabulous.

but are they amphibious?

We have hundreds of buses come by our house everyday. They shake our house and can be very loud. They also pollute a lot, so we don’t dare eat veggies grown in our yard. I’m willing to give a new street car a chance.

I like the strassenbahn in Germany. They go slower in the city center, but on the outskirts they haul. The Streetcars in Hiroshima were pretty good too.

I’m not wrapped up in the romance of New Orleans, either.

Well, as someone who lived there, I don’t know what the hell you’re talking about. It’s just a great way to travel. Cheap and fun.

They also pollute a lot, so we don’t dare eat veggies grown in our yard

Wow. That’s…intense.

I don’t know what bus exhaust could do to a vegetable garden.

Think decades of leaded gasoline emissions, and what it would do to the soil.

Exhaust leaves chemicals on the topsoil that leeches into the veggies.

Our street cars were electric. How’s that for “progressive?” Maybe they all are, I don’t know. But I can still hear the “zzzztt zzztt” as they lost and re-gained connection with the overhead wires as they went crawling by.

Oh no! “Zzzzzt!” The horror!

Bad for the environment, I’m sure.

I’m just glad to live in an era of noiseless vehicles.

There has been a transit hub one block from our house for over 100 years. It has been a bus garage since the 50s or 60s. That’s a lot of diesel fumes in our yard to leach into our veggies and then our bodies. I know that veggies from the farmers market or store might not be better, but we aren’t going to knowingly poison ourselves.

When I lived in the French Quarters, donkeys went by. They went “clop clop clip clop.” I listen to that noise in horror. Now sometimes pedestrians go by, and I will hear them go “step step step step step.”

It makes me shiver, I tells you.

I like the “zzzzt!” It makes me want to holster my gat, put on my trenchcoat, and find out what my buddies Sam Spade and Philip Marlowe are up to on this foggy night.

Apparently there was a terrible streetcar crash right in front of our house (I think the line went down 44th Ave N).

We used to have guys driving horse-drawn wagons up and down the alleys, yelling “rags!. rags!” (I never knew if they were buying or selling) The horse poop they left behind was not too environmentally friendly if you tracked some into your mama’s house.

Wayne has some thoughts about your mama, Maz.

So to answer your question, Jen, Most Minneapolitans are nice, some are unhappy, and they’re terrible at staying on topic.

Wayne’s dad should do what needs to be done to the boy.

kurtis…what were we talking about, again?

As long as we’re talking about transit and streetcars and stuff. The first streetcar line connecting the downtowns in the late 1800s took 45 minutes from one DT to the other. The Central Corridor light rail will take 37 minutes. 115 years, $1 billion, we gain 8 minutes. Progress, baby!

I shudder to think what mazaspaza thinks is the right thing to do to young boys…

You see that Wayne quoted above?
His vitriol fits like a glove
I find it a hoot
And ironic, to boot
He attends something called “Too Much Love”

Yeah and that 1800’s version probably only took a couple of weeks to build and get approval from the local populace and political authorities.

Raindog…2 words:

“coup stick”

People are nice here! Except when you’re a dick them. Then not so much.

Unless make it an express route that boards only at the downtown stations, or expect modern day commuters to board the train in 5 seconds or less, I don’t see how you cut trip time much more.

Besides, considering that at least part of the area between the two downtowns was much more sparsely populated, if not outright rural, an 8 minutes shorter trip seems pretty good.

I’ve taken the 94 bus across town in 15 minutes. I think express rail routes would be awesome.

I don’t care what anybody says, I think raingog is kinda funny sometimes.

Max, I am still giggling from your last comment. “Step step step step.” Oh, the humanity!

Damn, I missed this?

I need to make some popcorn, set aside a half hour, and read over this thread. No time now, though.

People still go to TML? Way to be hip, Wayne. Rage against the college kids while using your student ID to get in free.

Wow, looks like I opened a can of worms with my (I thought?) innocent question. Thanks for all the responses, and even for the obligatory comment-wars Re: Kurtis’ question, I’m moving to Minnesota largely for a change (you might have gathered that I’m not fond of Utah). I visited there recently and promptly fell in love with the area, and the job market in my career field seems fairly strong. I also have a few friends who live there so I won’t be completely and totally alone in a new city.

Can’t wait to actually walk into a bar on my own accord….

See, being in Utah so long you forgot how to go to bars. You drive your Accord to the bar and then walk home from the bar.

People here are jerks.

Come and visit us again when you get settled and tell us how it is going. Welcome!

jpix:

Show up and see what happens.

Ive noticed that everyone who moved here from somewhere else thinks Mn sucks. I haven’t really done too much traveling. I’ve been down south a couple of times and other than the accent i didnt notice a big difference. In georgia the only thing i noticed was everyone prefer way over the limit. Im talking ninety in a 55 mph zone.

People still go to TML? Way to be hip, Wayne. Rage against the college kids while using your student ID to get in free.

First off, I don’t have a college ID, dipshit.
Secondly, in regards to being ‘hip’ or whatever, I will quote an oft-played song there:

I don’t give a damn/I don’t give a fuck

If I may chime in. I’m an Arizona native who had the pleasure of living in Minnesota for just a few years in the mid 90’s. Based on the people I met living in Minnesota and the many snowbirds that come down to AZ, I would say Minnesotan’s are wonderful people. In my opinion they are very polite and respectful with strong family values. This is a big reason I hope to someday move my family up there.