Secrets of the City

Yesterday we were supposed to take up a bill allowing students to appeal if they fail their graduation tests.

Will the funding we lose be more or less than $400 Million?

A teacher should know that it’s “more important” not “more importantly,” unless you mean that you are saying this in a more important fashion, which is possible, I guess.

So how are you going to make him care, Mr. or Ms. Taxpayer, because loss of federal funding means more out of YOUR pocket

Anything that reduces spending is good. I pay federal tax also. If the kids don’t care their is not much you can do. The amount of federal funding is not the majority of the schools budget so I really don’t care at all that they cut off money to failing schools, too bad so sad.

When they first started this policy of required testing for graduation, my kid passed the test when he was in the 9th grade. What does that tell you?

His teacher fed him the answers?

i just finished proctoring students where i teach, and am now scarfing down a lunch in the ten minutes i have to eat today. just a brief note–many schools do require passing scores for graduation. ours does.

AND, one more things. kids take tests in grades 9, 10, and 11. grade 9 is writing, grade 10 is reading, and grade 11 is math. i’m pretty sure i wouldn’t pass the math portion. word on the street is addition of a science test in the next few years. i’m not sure what grade level that would be at, though.

I really don’t care at all that they cut off money to failing schools

Out of curiosity, I’d like you to take a stab at defining what you think about when you talk about a “failing school.” Let’s define that term a bit.

“When they first started this policy of required testing for graduation, my kid passed the test when he was in the 9th grade. What does that tell you?” – maz

That he got his brains from his mom?

…too bad so sad.

This has to be one of the most annoying phrases I see. Plus, when it’s used as much as swandog uses it, it’s got to be indicative of a complete and utter lack of empathy.

it’s got to be indicative of a complete and utter lack of empathy.

Not to mention punctuation.

Swandog’s attitude is typical of the modern talking point pundit lover.

What I call the “I got mine; so screw you and yours.” philosophy.

Let’s take a little looksie:

“Anything that reduces spending is good.”
False.

Do you really want to cut all police and fire services?

“If the kids don’t care their is not much you can do.”
True.
Which may be why Swandog often uses “their” instead of “there” in addition to making other basic grammatical mistakes.

Something tells me Swandog was one of those kids that just didn’t care.

Swandog is to taxes as binky is to guns, wayne is to public transportation, and Maz is to life. Sometimes people simply can’t discuss a topic without becoming shrill, defensive, and unreasonable. Best to just discourage them from participating in discussions that trigger thier knees to jerk.

What I call the “I got mine; so screw you and yours.” philosophy.

No I disagree, I do not want to pay for everyone elses program I would like to keep my money. I am not rich and feel that I am over taxed, I do not agree with income distribution through the tax code.

Anything that reduces spending is good.”
False.

really, and why is that. We obviously have increased the welfare state in the last thirty years and what do we have to show for it.

Which may be why Swandog often uses “their” instead of “there” in addition to making other basic grammatical mistakes

I am not the best writer, to bad so sad.

Something tells me Swandog was one of those kids that just didn’t care.
I do not understand your point. If I disagree with tax policy I don’t care.

Swandog is to taxes as binky is to guns, wayne is to public transportation, and Maz is to life. Sometimes people simply can’t discuss a topic without becoming shrill, defensive, and unreasonable. Best to just discourage them from participating in discussions that trigger their knees to jerk.

You might want to look at when discussions increase and people read the web site. without us it is just a bunch of people circle jerking each other off.

You say that like it’s a bad thing.

hey! is that circle jerky anything like bacon?

No I disagree, I do not want to pay for everyone elses program I would like to keep my money.

Do you make your money in a vacuum? Or do you have to rely on our infrastructure to make it? Do you suppose that the simple fact that you are allowed to make money in our society means anything?

Do you make your money in a vacuum? Or do you have to rely on our infrastructure to make it? Do you suppose that the simple fact that you are allowed to make money in our society means anything

I pay plenty to cover all of those things. “in our society”, what is that. You seem to think that you are owed something from other peoples labor. You are owed nothing. The statement of: “our society” points to the idea that I owe society something more than I have am already paid. Our society is the voting electorate and my goal is to reduce the amount of taxes we pay on “our society”.

By bitching about it on MNSpeak?

Not a very effective plan.

By bitching about it on MNSpeak?

Not a very effective plan.

your right this is just fun.

It is fun, but not for the reasons you think it is.

Just FYI

Minnesotans work until April 27 to pay their taxes. After that, your money is your own.

Where swandog and I differ is, to him it’s about money. He wants to keep more of his earnings to spend as he wishes. That’s cool.

To me, it’s about power. The more the government taxes and regulates the more power they have. And the more power they have, the less power YOU have. But I guess that’s a little too heavy for this crowd to differentiate. So, carry on.

People are often willing to give up a little power or freedom for a little security.

I think Ben Franklin or someone said the person who gives up freedom for security deserves neither, but he’s dead. And it sounds like something a politician would say, not a single mother with small children.

Inre: health care. Isn’t freedom from worry about paying for illness freedom in another way?

If they give up a little power or security, couldn’t that be a reasonable tradeoff?

Liberty, like love, is a vague enough word that it can be abused by people who would define it to mean anything they want it to, like the word love, in the way that abusive husbands claim to love their wives.

Inre: health care. Isn’t freedom from worry about paying for illness freedom in another way?

But you could use that argument for any of life’s necessities. Why wouldn’t the mother worry about food or shelter before she worries about medical needs? Wouldn’t the good nanny state be offering free food or free shelter before they even get around to offering free medical care? Is food a right? Is shelter a right?

The state does provide food and dhelter, and, yes, it is a right.

If it’s a right, why do any of us have to pay for it? Why do we have for-profit grocery stores? Why do we have to pay for city water?

Good questiojn. Why did we take the common treasury that is the earth and convert it all into property, and take even the things that people need to survive and convert them into commerce?

Probably so that one person can make a profit off another person’s misery.

Yay, liberty.

I donno. I want without health insurance for awhile. It’s one of the worst feelings I ever had. I thought that if I ever got truly sick or injured the health care industry could roll right over me. I’m pretty lucky, now and I’m grateful. My parents didn’t have it, and my Dad was getting healthcare at the VA for a terminal illness.

Stuff like that makes a guy a Democrat.

I donno. I want without health insurance for awhile. It’s one of the worst feelings I ever had. I thought that if I ever got truly sick or injured the health care industry could roll right over me. I’m pretty lucky, now and I’m grateful. My parents didn’t have it, and my Dad was getting healthcare at the VA for a terminal illness.

Stuff like that makes a guy a Democrat.

Where swandog and I differ is, to him it’s about money. He wants to keep more of his earnings to spend as he wishes. That’s cool.

To me, it’s about power. The more the government taxes and regulates the more power they have. And the more power they have, the less power YOU have. But I guess that’s a little too heavy for this crowd to differentiate. So, carry on.

I agree with you maz that it is about power. However, I am being taxed out of existence. My power to choose is being taken by the state and redistributed to others. I am not rich nor am I poor. The middle class is being destroyed by tax policy. Their was a time that the tax policies did help the middle class but now the tax code is used by the Dem’s to buy votes and the republicans to gain favor through Corp welfare for the rich. It is killing the average Joe like myself. The power is with the government and it’s ability to control through oppressive tax codes and make us dependent upon them, that is the problem. But the solutions to the problems are diminishing quickly. I do not see any solution at this time but for both parties to be re-vamped tax code or we will diminish our selves as a nation. Look at the dollar it is not a good thing for this country. I see it as a sign of things to come. At some point their will not be a middle class to pay the taxes that propagate the services that make the liberals happy. The wealth of this nation is in decline and it seems to me we are just riding on a bankrupt sinking ship.

I don’t begrudge your dad getting medical care from the VA, because as a veteran, he earned it.

Aha. Once again, we see the rules bend when it conveniences Maz.

Actually, it’s pretty much the same rule, and it bends the same every time, but still.

I don’t begrudge your dad getting medical care from the VA, because as a veteran, he earned it.

And why should someone be excluded if they’re not in a position to “earn it” through military service?

Because it doesn’t directly benefit Maz, who is also a veteran.

If medical care was bought and sold like any other market commodity, you’d buy your own medical care. The cost is artifically high, making you want someone else to pay for it. But you didn’t earn it, like Rat’s dad did.

Maz is right about medical costs being artificially high, but that’s driven more by HMO’s than the government.

He got paid for his service. He dserves to get any wounds he sustained in combat paid for. Anything else is just gravy, and gravy you happen to agree with, because you get the same benefits.

It’s just sheer hypocracy. But, hey, let’s shut down those libraries.

“earning it” like Rat’s dad did wasn’t even an OPTION for me. Last I heard, unless the Iraq situation has gotten that bad, they don’t take people with semi-functional ears. So much for equality.

No market is going to bring medical care costs down to a point where the average working stiff can afford it. No market system is going to bring us $1,000 chemotherapy, no market system is going to bring us $2000 cochlear implants. No market system is going to bring us affordable organ transplants or open heart surgery.

I donno. I want without health insurance for awhile. It’s one of the worst feelings I ever had. I thought that if I ever got truly sick or injured the health care industry could roll right over me. I’m pretty lucky, now and I’m grateful. My parents didn’t have it, and my Dad was getting healthcare at the VA for a terminal illness.

Stuff like that makes a guy a Democrat

I think if we all really look at things closely we are all a bit scared. I know I am. We all argue and banter but in the end if you really look at what people are saying the underlying motive is a level of fear. Fear of losing a job, of becoming sick, ect. ect. . The question is how do we reasonably solve the problems of this society. We are in a tough spot and the problem is that their is no more wiggle room as a society. I think we are at the post-modern-welfare state stage. I personally do not see how we can increase taxes anymore I do not have it and others in my situation do not have it either. The pie is only so big and the country is declining both in terms of wealth and power. I hope their is some kind of compromise position but it will need to be in a form that all classes agree to. You can’t continue to take my money and redistribute it and drive me down I won’t vote for that. However, I do see some kind of need for a compromise in both what is expected out of all members of society and what is a reasonable amount to pay in taxes.

I ain’t afraid of nuthin.

No market is going to bring medical care costs down to a point where the average working stiff can afford it. No market system is going to bring us $1,000 chemotherapy, no market system is going to bring us $2000 cochlear implants. No market system is going to bring us affordable organ transplants or open heart surgery.

We won’t know until we try it.

Have you been alive in America for the past few years? Prices are going up, man.

No market is going to bring medical care costs down to a point where the average working stiff can afford it.

But look what has happened in markets for elective surgery, like laser eye care or cosmetic surgery. It’s gone down because doctors have to compete.

It’s not free, but it’s more affordable.

Do you think it’s supposed to be free? Because it never will be. Someone pays for it.

Did you know that many, if not most Canadians carry some kind of supplemental health insurance?

Laser eye care is outpatient surgery, and relatively cheap to perform.

But when it first came out, it was $5,000 per eye.

But look what has happened in markets for elective surgery, like laser eye care or cosmetic surgery. It’s gone down because doctors have to compete.

It’s not free, but it’s more affordable.

And still out of reach of most people.

Let’s look at hearing aids. Hearing aids are paid out of pocket for the most part. Yet hearing aid costs haven’t gone down. Only about 23% of those who would benefit from using hearing aids actually have them. Cost ($1,500-5,000 EACH, depending on the model) is a major factor in that low usage rate.

It’s a widely used surgery, and so is going to be cheaper, because there is a lagrer market for it. But the free market is never going to make treatment for having Toxic Epidermal Necrolysis cheap, because it is a very rare disease.

And still out of reach of most people.

It’s not $25 and change, but people buy flat screen TVs on a no-interest-for-12-months payment plan at close to the same price and they don’t even bat an eye.

Deaf and hard of hearing people often make less money than the rest of the population, in part because of their deafness, in part because education for the deaf has often been terrible, and in part because deafness is often a disease of poverty.

Do you think it’s supposed to be free? Because it never will be.

Free, no. I just expect that, as with every other civilized country in the world, the cost will be greatly defrayed because it will be spread out onto the entire population, rather than being the burden of one person. That is how we handle things like education, police, fire departments, national security, etc.

Deaf and hard of hearing people often make less money than the rest of the population, in part because of their deafness, in part because education for the deaf has often been terrible, and in part because deafness is often a disease of poverty.

Somebody’s been studying.

I took sign language in college. All of which I have forgotten.

The science test starts this year. It’s all online and only on Biology.
Off Topic: I’ve heard this deal about kids can pass tests in their ninth grade year. Hey that’s great, but there is more to high school than just grades. NCLB doesn’t see it that way, but it should.