Secrets of the City

So the next logical step is to ban cigarettes altogether, right?

That’s what’s coming, folks.

Sorry about the goofy looking formating…

I’m pretty indifferent when it comes to the smoking ban, but I’m really sick of listening to this guy go on and on about it.

Skoal is where it’s at, anyway.

Eff that…if they ban smokes, I’m definately moving to Canada…

but I’m really sick of listening to this guy go on and on about it.

Yeah, me too. When is that jerk going to shut up?

Oh, wait…

Tom Hallett rips Pulse publisher Ed Felien a new one

I tend to agree that a ban on indoor smoking is “just the beginning”, much the same way that our decades-old DWI laws are really creeping prohibition.

MADD may be a neo/crypto-prohibitionist group, and it’s possible that even the ALA is — but that doesn’t mean there is any kind of support for passing more stupid laws about the private conduct of consenting adults. It ends here.

Chewing tobacco never did it for me when I was a smoker, so if you still like having a cigarette with your beer, then Skol is where it’s at.

Now if we could just get a “Freedom to Drink” act requiring every bar to serve at least one Minnesota-native beer for every “light” beer poured, preferably not Premo or Schell’s.

OMG! I have no reason to leave the State of Minnesota ever again!

It’ll be weird to go to other states and be all like, “Why is there smoking in this Applebee’s?”

Smoking in TGIFriday’s will be so Dark Ages! Word!

I, for one, am very happy about this law.

Having lost my mother – at the too young age of 57- to Brain and Lung Cancer last month, I think that if this law saves anyone’s family and loved ones from going through such a devastating situation – then it is worth it.

As a former smoker I can appreciate people who smoke feeling they are being persecuted. If I was still a smoker I would feel the same way.

I know in some places, like SLC, there are private Smoker’s Clubs that have opened where people can get together and puff. I realize it is a personal choice but I think denial is at work with those who ignore the risks. I was the same way, when I smoked.

I never could get my Mom to quit. Sometimes I wish I would have tried harder. But she loved to smoke. I miss her every day. My daughter was only 5 months old when my Mom died. She’ll never get to know her Grandma.

I’m pretty indifferent when it comes to the smoking ban, but I’m really sick of listening to this guy go on and on about it.

No kidding. I support the damn ban just to shut him up.

Bob, you deserve to take a bow. You’ve helped make the state a healthier, more pleasant place. And saved lives. Let the Maz’ and other FreedomNazis of the world blow a fuse. Just as long as they don’t blow smoke in my face.

“private conduct” … in a public place … sheesh…

I never could get my Mom to quit

Me either. However, on a bright note, my sister Darla (whose twin Carla died of cancer) has been smokfree for about three years. Darla was the heaviest smoker in the family, and I never thought she could do it, but she surprised me.

FreedomNazis

Boy, we’re Through the Looking Glass now. Freedom is Nazi-like and forcing people into the street, hectoring businesses and humliation gets the applause.

That was just a little Colbertesque misdirection for the humorless. You took the bait, Rat.

I usually do.

Finally, damn. Yay smoking ban!

More government regulation. Long live Libertarians!

I bet if people that chewed tobacco went around spitting on people all they time that would get outlawed also. But chewers don’t do that so nobody minds.

Finally, damn. Yay smoking ban!

Yah, indeed, Detroit Diva. And I will never support banning garlic mashed potatoes with butter!

So the next logical step is to ban cigarettes altogether, right?

Or maybe the next step is to be like Berkeley and use the smoking ban to get those pesky vagrants off of our streets.

Please note that no one will be allowed to sit in the open-air patios without a lit cigarette in their mouth.

(This isn’t a bad thing, smokers. I’ve been going outside to light up for a long time, ‘cuz, well, it smells, and I’m not really sure why others should have to inhale it if they don’t want to and so it just strikes me as simple politeness and civility, and I can tell you that having to get up and walk outside every half-hour or so keeps you very attuned to the state of your own inebriation. If you can’t make it outside for a smoke, you should probably slow down, and you sure as hell shouldn’t drive yourself home.)

Congrats, Bob. Be sure to save me one of those cigars you’ve been handing out today.

OK, we have a smoking ban. OK PiPress, what are the details? We know Timmy signed the thing, but what does it say? Exceptions? Very nice reporting there. It is meaningless without the details! Bob? Just Plain Bob? Bueller?

I never thought Berkeley would be so Un-Berkeley-like. ___Insert Maz/ bud jr. anti-university administration liberal collectivist rant here___

That is one of the details I want to know about. Is that in the law the Timmy signed? I hadn’t heard whether it made it into the final version…

The Strib story from the weekend had more detail (as well as reaction).

In a nutshell, smoking will be prohibited in indoor restaurants, bars and clubs. No exceptions.

Patio service is back. Yah! That add-on to the Senate bill is gone (it had been added by an opponent, BTW). Cities and counties are free to create tougher ordinances of their own (read patios), but as I said before, I don’t think that’s likely. Bloomington and Golden Valley already have outdoor restrictions, they will remain.

Clearer?

Thanks Bob!!!

More details (with links to even MORE details) can be found at MPR’s Votetracker site.

It’s official: Ed Felien is a spineless, lying coward.

He ran Tom Hallett’s column in the print version of Pulse….minus all the bad stuff about Ed Felien.

Nice work Ed!
You completely suck!

“You completely suck!“

Mom always said, anything worth doing is worth doing well. So, he’s got THAT going for him . . .

i’m fine with the ban so whatever. i just hope there aren’t ridiculous laws that start to come with it like regulating outdoor smoking and patios like some places have. this is another one of those baited mnspeak posts so i’ll stop here.

It’s bad for Minnesota. You know if there isn’t a country-wide ban, people will just go to the next state to smoke.

Heh!

City Pages has more on Pulse’s Ed Felien and his latest shenanigans

The link doesn’t work…

sorry
here it is:
City Pages on Pulse

scroll down a little

lolz… omg max sparber graphic designer..

the tears.. they won’t stop…

Thanks for the laugh city pages… I needed that. Whew..

Minnesota is turning into like a mini-communist China. Everyone’s rights are being stripped away, thanks to the powers that be and the nanny liberals that control the DFL wing of the party; the republicans that basically voted for this measure are nothing but a bunch of Marxist turncoats that needed to be thrown out in the primary election by the general public. Yet, no true conservative with libertarian views would even dare to support a statewide smoking ban. It’s a fact.

Minnesota is turning into like a mini-communist China. Everyone’s rights are being stripped away, thanks to the powers that be and the nanny liberals that control the DFL wing of the party; the republicans that basically voted for this measure are nothing but a bunch of Marxist turncoats that needed to be thrown out in the primary election by the general public. Yet, no true conservative with libertarian views would even dare to support a statewide smoking ban. It’s a fact.

To quote Will Farrell as Alex Trebek: “And we’ve reached a new low.”

That’s comedy gold right there. That’s a fact.

LOL. Right after Big G’s comment, I quoted it over at the MNspeak thread at Metroblogging Minneapolis, which walks and talks just like a MNspeak thread. That’s a fact.

“Minnesota is turning into like a mini-communist China…”

Whut?

Thanks a lot, Big G. Now one of my pupils has dilated massively while the other shrank down to a tiny pinpoint. I think your post gave me an embolism.

Actually, Big G, there’s probably more communists at the U of MN than there are at Peking University. Seriously.

there’s probably more communists at the U of MN than there are at Peking University. Seriously.

…AND THAT’S A FACT!

Actually, we still knock the shit outta Commies at da U.

http://www.citypages.com/databank/28/1380/article15448.asp

It’s funny that conservatives still use “communism” or it’s even more nonsensical cousin “collectivism” to mean “anything I don’t like.” Just like lefties use “fascism” to mean “anything we don’t like.”

Does it contribute to a reasoned debate? My guess: You’re a fascist if you think so.

No, I use “communism” when I’m referring to communism. Leftists use “fascism” when they’re referring to anything to the right of Wellstone.

Personally, I’m thrilled that there is now a Freedom to Breathe Act. Will it get the stinky automobiles and school buses off the road too? I can’t wait to write the legislation, since I’m now, like, a j.d. and all.

No, I use “communism” when I’m referring to communism. Leftists use “fascism” when they’re referring to anything to the right of Wellstone.

Oh, come on. Honestly.

If Maz calls anyone here a communist, I’d doubt that he knows what one is.

With the number of lawyers in this state, and in society in general, I figure the average wage, due to market forces, should be about $12 an hour.

Maz fought communists in the big war. He knows what one is.

Maz fought communists in the big war. He knows what one is.

Fighting them and knowing what one is are two completely different things. That’s a fact.

I think maz just confirmed he’s a Nazi, as they were the only ones fighting communists in WWII. Or was maz fighting in WWI and there having been no nation-states that were communist at that time, I’d have to assume he was fist-fighting Russian factory workers.

As we all know, Veitnam was a conflict, not a war. Even if it were, no one refers to it as “the big war.

The reviews are in on FTB, and they are generally favorable. The Pioneer Press says “It’s a good day for Minnesota.” The West Central Tribune gives us a double — a story on the smoking ban and a photo of Pawenty from our “E85 Everywhere” rally at the Capitol. Last and very least, Kersten says we should have banned divorce and abortion instead.

smoking ban = B.S.

Maz is now referring to himself in the third person?

George is getting angry!*

*Seinfeld.

B.S. = brilliant strategy

David: Maz means the Cold War, I think. It is always hard to fathom the mind of DT, but I think that’s what he means…

The anti-smoking movement is a perfect crusade for our relativistic age. It is driven by self-righteousness, but has no moral dimension. If you try to limit “choice” in almost any other human behavior, prepare to be branded a interfering prig. With smoking, you’re a righteous crusader.

In our upside down age, it’s “I’m OK, you’re OK” where divorce or pornography are concerned. One wag summed it up this way: Today you can engage in almost any sexual activity you want, so long as you don’t have a cigarette afterwards.

Heh.

Maz is now referring to himself in the third person?

That was only a not-so-subtle dig at Rat. heh

I thought Maz served in a submarine. How many commies could you see from inside a submarine??? And how exactly did you “fight” them? With diving drills?

I have to appreciate Maz’s love of the chuckle.

And how exactly did you “fight” them? With diving drills?

Oh, you know what I mean. You’re just being obese, er obtuse.

Oh, you know what I mean. You’re just being obese, er obtuse.

No we don’t, because usually you’re either full of shit, exaggerating, making obnoxious claims or outrageous assumptions. That’s a fact.

First of all, if any of you have ever read The Communist Manifesto (Required reading at the Leftist – Commie Liberal Arts school I attended) You would KNOW that there has never EVER been a truly communist state. North Viet Nam would definitely not qualify for communists.

Secondly, communism is an economic system not a governmental system. It is where the workers own the means of production. The income is spread among those that do the work.

The closest thing we have to this concept is a small business owner who owns every aspect of his business. Now THAT would be a communist!

Either way, the communists were born to lose.

To see Maria Sharapova play tennis is to watch Marxism die.

“usually” being the key word here.

DouglasG, you easily forget:

Maz fought communists in the big war. He knows what one is.
»» Submitted by »»» mazasapa at 7:00 AM on May 17

That’s a fact, you terrorist.

I enjoy telling my russian immigrant friends that I spent a year of my life (a total of 360 days over 6 patrols) in 600 feet of water about 30 miles off the coast of their home country, just waiting for the order to vaporize their city.

They then proceed to tell me that while they weren’t communists, they know their neighbors were.

They didn’t use your technical and irrelevant academic definition either. heh.

Of course… I must have been brainwashed at my Lefty-Communist Liberal Arts Terrorist University.

The fact that he ‘fought’ communists from a submarine explains his inability to understand what actually makes someone a communist.

I’m getting really sick of you intelligent, educated and insightful people trying to have rational arguments with the irrational BSers with wacky opinions. Go away! You’re wasting your time!

Yes, your pansy-assed liberal academics! You don’t know that true communists are anyone to the left of fascism! Anyone who sees their neighbour as anything more than competition is obviously a pinko traitor! Keep up with the Joneses or face the wrath of McCarthy!

They didn’t use your technical and irrelevant academic definition either. heh.

Yeah, Maz, who needs definitions and facts anyway? Fuck them! These were real people’s opinions of reality. Right on, brotha!

I’m sure your mission was much more interesting than mine, wayne.

Reaction to this ban is odd. People deal with not being allow to smoke in workplaces for an 8-9-10 hour workday, but can’t manage the same restriction during a 1-hour meal in a restraurant. I don’t quite understand. The issue is the same – clean air in a social setting.

They then proceed to tell me that while they weren’t communists, they know their neighbors were.

Better yet, that’s like saying that I have a friend who has neighbors that he knows are conservatives, therefore he knows what conservatism is.

People like maz love the fearmongering about ‘islamofascism’ (wtf?) because it’s bringing back the red scare they so dearly missed.

Maz thinks sitting with his finger on the nuclear trigger is da bomb.

What were we talking about? Outlawing diet sodas? I’m for it!

Well, since this all happened before you were even born, wayne, I don’t expect you to know much about it. Except, that won’t prevent you from telling me you do.

“…but can’t manage the same restriction during a 1-hour meal in a restraurant.”

The restaurant owner who puts in a full day and who may have taken risks and a second mortgage to open a business should not be able to decide how he can run it?

Well, since this all happened before you were even born, wayne, I don’t expect you to know much about it. Except, that won’t prevent you from telling me you do.

It sucks when you can only know about what you’ve personally been alive during. History is worthless and doesn’t actually exist!

Unlike you, old man, I know how to read history books. Or books in general. Or newspapers. Or, you know, words.

Don’t forget, even if you were alive during something, if you didn’t actually witness it, it never happened.

The restaurant owner who puts in a full day and who may have taken risks and a second mortgage to open a business should not be able to decide how he can run it?

exactly….

smoking ban = B.S.

C’mon Rat. He can run it anyway he wants. He just can’t poison his customers or workers.

Hey, obviously, these youngsters don’t know anything about anything.

“Two beds on top of each other are bunk.” – Henry Ford.

BS = Been Signed

We can do this all day, roadking. You mess with the Lung, you gonna get stung.

C’mon Rat. He can run it anyway he wants. He just can’t poison his customers or workers.

His customers and employees are there by CHOICE.

I know when I go out to drink, or work at an establishment, and the business owner decides to randomly shoot a gun in his place of business, I shouldn’t complain, and it shouldn’t be illegal, because we are there by CHOICE.

I know when I go out to drink, or work at an establishment, and the business owner decides to randomly shoot a gun in his place of business, I shouldn’t complain, and it shouldn’t be illegal, because we are there by CHOICE

I think I’ve been to that kind of bar, Max.

I know when I go out to drink, or work at an establishment, and the business owner decides to randomly shoot a gun in his place of business, I shouldn’t complain, and it shouldn’t be illegal, because we are there by CHOICE.

I would imagine if such a place existed, it wouldn’t be around for long. Get it? Exactly what is wrong with the business owner deciding whether or not to allow smoking? That way you and the health-cop, Bob can go to your bar and I will go to mine with a pack of Marlboros in hand. Then everybody is happy.

Wow. What’s going on with the 4th Street Saloon? And why won’t the Star Tribune print the color of their mojitos?

OMG U GUYZ EVERY1 HAS A CHOIZE WHERE THEY GO AND SPEND MONEY SO THE GUBBMENT NEEDS TO BUG OFF BECUZ PPLZ WILL TOTALLY NOT GO TO PLACES THAT DO BAD STUFF THEY DON’T LIEK! ITZ LIKE THE FREE MARKET AND STUFF!

(hey, maybe he’s starting to get it!)

If by “it” you mean a disease of the brain …

AND LIEK, IF ALL THOSE PPLZ WHO OWN BUZNASES DECIDE TO DO SOMETHING YOU DON’T LIEK, YOU SHOULD JUST STOP USING THEIR BUZINASES EVEN IF THERE ARE NO OTHER CHOICEZ BECAUSE THATZ HOW IT WERKZ! TUFF SHIATH TO U!

You mess with the Lung, you gonna get stung.

You obviously represent a powerful group, Bob. A real Machine.

wayne, for such a smart guy you sure are an idiot. I mean that in the kindest way possible.

finally, the government is doing something to HELP public health.

i hope all you smokers don’t get frost bite this winter :p

We can agree to disagree. Reasonable people can do this.

Smoking bans are great. Moved from ND to California and my favorite thing is that I don’t have to deal with the stink that emanates off of smokers and their cigs. Now I’m moving to Minnesota soon and this just makes it better.

Now you guys just need to let up on your stupid liquor laws. I want to buy my Scotch from the 7-11 like civilized people.

or… we can enjoy disagreeing. BTW – i submitted your resume today.

Then everybody is happy.

That’s the point. Can’t have that in the nanny state.

The restaurant owner who puts in a full day and who may have taken risks and a second mortgage to open a business should not be able to decide how he can run it?

Owners didn’t have carte blanche before the smoking ban went into effect. They have to follow regulations, such as health codes, EEO laws, labor laws, minimum wage, and OSHA requirements, to name a few.

That’s the point. Can’t have that in the nanny state.

It seems that most on mnspeak are bright enough to understand this logic but it seems that a good argument is too difficult to pass up.

No, I referred only to myself, in the third person. It’s a habit I picked up from you, Rat.

What? no drive-through like in Texas?

Most here believe the government is their mother.

“Then everybody is happy.”

“That’s the point. Can’t have that in the nanny state.”

Can’t have that in any state. Pursuit of happiness =/ happiness.

OK, except maybe in some crazy utopia. Like in Logan’s Run.

That’s the point. Can’t have that in the nanny state.

That’s not logic, it’s a bumper sticker. Both the left and the right uses the phrase “nanny state,” and it is equally meaningless from both.

Thx, Brett!

I do enjoy a good argument on the interwebs, though.

In fact, my father and I spar over this kind of thing all the time just because we enjoy it. Sometimes he just defends things he doesn’t agree with to get me going. I love my dad!

Nonetheless, Bob

But you don’t love me? what the?

Most here believe the government is their mother.

I hope not! My mother isn’t great with money.

Sorry, Dennis. You’re too crotchety even for me. My dad will at least admit when he’s wrong, even if he argues the point beyond that point just to get my goat.

heh

That’s not logic, it’s a bumper sticker. Both the left and the right uses the phrase “nanny state,” and it is equally meaningless from both.

If I ever say it, it will not be meaningless. To me the “nanny state” refers to some folks deciding that we all need the government to force us to live life a certain way in order to make us “safer”. Take the seatbelt law for example: why in the hell is it anybody’s business whether or not i wear my seatbelt?

Thx, Brett!

Party on, Wayne.

I found this interesting perspective from another forum on the internets (not mine).

I think we’ve all been had.

Yet, this is the foundation for all of the anti-smoking legislation popping up around the world. Does this make sense to anyone else here??

We all realized long ago that this wasn’t about facts.

Facts are over-rated. Just ask Roadkill, er, Roadking…

Right back at you, nameless shill for Phillip Morris.

I know the case you speak of. That federal court was in North Carolina, and it was a lawsuit from Big Tobacco against the EPA. That ruling was quickly overturned by a higher court.

“Smoking bans are great. Moved from ND to California and my favorite thing is that I don’t have to deal with the stink that emanates off of smokers and their cigs. Now I’m moving to Minnesota soon and this just makes it better.

Now you guys just need to let up on your stupid liquor laws. I want to buy my Scotch from the 7-11 like civilized people.“

Um, sorry, kdukart, I suppose I should have told you this earlier, but I hate the stink of scotch that emanates off of you scotch drinkers, so we’ll be banning that next week. Try Florida. They’re all really into bad odors down there.

“Take the seatbelt law for example: why in the hell is it anybody’s business whether or not i wear my seatbelt? “

That’s easy. Because when you get into an accident without a seatbelt, my local hospital is required by law to treat you whether or not you have the means to pay for it. If you can’t then I, as a taxpayer or a consumer at that hospital, pay for your idiocy. I don’t like paying for your idiocy, thus the law making you wear your seatbelt.

I guess we could get rid of the law saying that the hospitals have to treat you and leave you writhing in pain on the sidewalk while the hospital waits on hold with your insurance company to see if they’ll pay for an idiot who didn’t wear his seatbelt, but even idiots deserve pain meds.

“Um, sorry, kdukart, I suppose I should have told you this earlier, but I hate the stink of scotch that emanates off of you scotch drinkers, so we’ll be banning that next week. Try Florida. They’re all really into bad odors down there.”

That’s a very nice attempt at a mocking and ironic parallel argument but I’m going to have to ask you to revise as Scotch is rarely or never burned when ingested and I, for one, have never seen or sensed its odor slowly emanate across a room. I have sensed that happen with flatulence but most people have the decency to not fart in a public place. Smokers have not developed that level of decency. But if they ever do, then by all means, lift the ban!

AND THATS A FACT

“I’m going to have to ask you to revise as Scotch is rarely or never burned when ingested and I, for one, have never seen or sensed its odor slowly emanate across a room.“

When you sense an odor, you’ve detected certain compounds outgassed from the substance being smelled. The burning is irrelevant. I can smell a Glenlivet from across the room.

Your point wasn’t, “it’s bad for us, good thing it’s banned”, it was “I hate your smell, good thing it was banned.” My point was, “and then they came for the scotch, and there was no one left to protest.” Or, shorter version, don’t be a gloating jerk.

kdukart , you can do better than that I hope…

I don’t like paying for your idiocy

What are you talking about? That’s the definition of being a liberal! You love paying for other people’s idiocy.

Right back at you, nameless shill for Phillip Morris.

I know the case you speak of. That federal court was in North Carolina, and it was a lawsuit from Big Tobacco against the EPA. That ruling was quickly overturned by a higher court.

Go back and re-read the post.

For the sake of argument — the question around the validity of the report was conceded

Try again.

The ad that really set me off was the one that said that people increased their chance of dying of a heart attack by 300 percent if they entered a smoke filled room. That one screamed for context but in 30 seconds all they need to do was throw out the number. The truth doesn’t matter when your on a Mission from God.

I don’t like paying for your idiocy, thus the law making you wear your seatbelt.

How, exactly, are you paying for my alleged idiocy? What a moron.

Stay out on the left coast, freakshow…

BTW – smoking ban still = B.S.

B. S. = Bob’s Soapbox.

I’m just going to keep going until you run out of witty retorts, Bob.

Here goes – smoking ban = B.S.

In no way does the smoking ban equal Bob Saget. The guy is an academy award winner!

I’ll give you all a few minutes to come to grips with that fact. It took me a few.

Won a Student Academy Award in 1977 for his documentary Through Adam’s Eyes (1977).

Is that more or less prestigious than an Emmy?

Hey, it’s still on Oscar. I ai’t got one, despite my notable work on Timeless.

B.S. = Bummed Sailor

Here, Captain Fishsticks (aka Craig Westover, Pioneer Press “hobby columnist’) bemoans the statewide smoking ban. For those who don’t keep up on such issues, the “Kelo” decision is a controversial Supreme Court decision on eminent domain that has nothing whatsoever to do with smoking and the proven health risks of secondhand smoke.

Interestingly, I personally agree with him on Kelo. It was the worst decision the Supremes have made since Dred Scott. Dred Scott once lived at Fort Snelling, BTW.

Is that more or less prestigious than an Emmy?

See? I told you these media awards are a bad idea. It only encourages them.

Interestingly, I personally agree with him on Kelo.

Oh, so you agree with the notion of private property rights. I’m shocked.

See? I told you these media awards are a bad idea. It only encourages them.

Maybe MNSpeak needs a Golden Troll award…so many deserving candidates!